Vocal mix down...

[Vin-Su]

Hi everyone, I am in need of some tech know how..

I record with a condenser mic feed into my behringer mixer then into my pc. I use soundforge for recording and Acid pro for mixing.

For the longest while I have tried panning and effects but I dont get the same sound that professionals get on there choruses but whenever I listen to them on my 5.1 surround sound system the different vocal parts of my mix dont work my different speakers as would a professional track.

Can anyone break down the mixing of harmonies/churuses and back up vocals? for instance panning % of the main voice and what effects need to be addded to it.


thank you all very much

[Blue Bear Sound]

There are no "% panning" rules or guidelines -- it's COMPLETELY dependent on the context of each song.

However - a mixing primer might help --> Mixing 101

[Vin-Su]

Thanks Bear, I checked out the article.

I think i understand more or less what u mean, but could anyone explain the basic steps you take to optimize the various vocal parts of your songs please?


thank you

[Daenn]

Well, personally, I record straight in through the preamp. (I have an Mbox and Pro Tools). From there I compress the vox and normalize if it's needed.

But I also track a lot of vocals. I'm not a very good singer, so I need all the help I can get. I do quiet parts and loud parts seperately, screaming (and man I suck at that) all on different tracks and compress depending on how the voice is laid out. I usually take one of the 3 or 4 tracks for the main vocal and compress the piss out of it and add a little chorus and mix it in low. Throw on some verb and delay and it doesn't sound too horrible. I am going to give that whisper track that Massive Master and the other guys were talking about in that other thread a try on the next song. Sounds cool. My vox usually still don't sound very good, but, well, that's how I do it.

[boze]

i'm not very experienced with vocal recording either, but i think lots of proper studios have a voice channel that can cost more than a BMW by the time it gets into protools or whatever.

what kind of mic do you have? i use an AT4033 - two of them sometimes, though i here that the 4040's are cheaper and better. after that i'm just experimenting with gentle compression, eq, and some reverb on an aux track.

maybe spending a few bucks on a mic pre would help your vocals? i'm curious about these two pieces of kit:

http://m-audio.com/index.php?do=prod...c80481dc5efffa

http://m-audio.com/index.php?do=prod...0efe8e92c25b76

the DMP3 is supposed to be selling for $150 at Guitar Center i think. the big tampa looks tasty as well because i could run it into the digital ins of my FW410.

i'm guessing that apart from a good performance and a good room, a snazzy signal chain effectively used is where nice vocals come from. that's easy for me to say though because i'm just practicing guitar/vocal stuff now though, so there's very little to mix compared to lots of ppl here.

good luck!

[grinder]

Are you mixing on a program designed to mix 5.1?

[TexRoadkill]

Forget about sounding on good on 5.1 systems until you get your mixes to kick ass on 2 speakers.

[Vin-Su]

Originally posted by grinder
Are you mixing on a program designed to mix 5.1?

No i'm not, a matter of fact i didn't think twice about that!!!

and yes I agree with you that I need to get my act together on two speakers before I can even think about 5.1

Does anyone know of a program to mix in 5.1 and what the whole process is like? and how would u rate my mixing on the following track...

http://fileserv5.soundclick.com/fast...mideevinsu.mp3

I mixed the Lumidee accapella and I both recorded and mixed the rap parts.

[glynb]

Originally posted by Vin-Su

Does anyone know of a program to mix in 5.1 and what the whole process is like? and how would u rate my mixing on the following track...

http://fileserv5.soundclick.com/fast...mideevinsu.mp3

Hi Vin-Su,
I listened to the track. Not my kind of genre, I'm more on the rock side but i do hear some of this stuff on the radio.

Your basic mix sounded fine to my ears for this genre. I think you've done a good job in that respect. However, I think my main issue would be with some of the lines the female sings. To my ears they were just plain out of tune. Sorry. She's obviously a fine singer because the rest of the song she sings well, but there's a section 'If you want me to stay...' which doesn't seem to fit to the music like she's singing in a different key?
But like I say, as far as basic groove goes you've nailed it, as good as many other treacks I've heard on the radio in a similar r'n'b style..

Good luck with it.

[mallcore pop]

Uh-oh! Glynb, wait 'til you hear where he got the vocals. . .

(edit: now that I've heard it, the track isn't his either. Oy. Please lose the Lumidee, or the Beatnuts track, or both. Thanks!)

[boze]

the internet.. what are ya gonna do....

[Vin-Su]

Probably i didnt explain it properly :-)

I recorded and mixed the rap parts, but i only mixed the Lumidee accapella onto the beat.

[glynb]

Even though I'm a rocker, I'm fully aware that rap and hip hop and r'n'b artists 'borrow' stuff from elsewhere and mix it together to create something 'original' - eminem using Dido's track is the most obvious exmaple that springs to mind.

I'd never heard of any of the 'original' tracks used here, so could only listen to the piece of music as i heard it. In this mix the vocal part doeasn't fit in one section cos it's out of tune with the backing IMHO, regardless of what the original song sounded like.

Come to think of it, maybe someone who is unfamiliar with the original source songs is better placed to judge the new mix?

[mallcore pop]

glynb, I was just teasin' Vin-Su (no need to take offense)!

It's funny, the Lumidee vocals are not in tune with the original track either. Yikes. The only reason that damn song did so well was the diwali beat, and he goes and samples the vocals...

Again, Vin-Su, it did well in spite of, not because of her vocals! Lose the sample, and have one of our guys a few forums down hook you up with an original beat (it's bad enough that Jenny On The Cock jacked it).

I'm hearing some good flow, it needs a track to match. Good luck!

[alphadelta80]

I could be wrong but, I think we were supposed to give our opinion on the mix itself. If that's the case, I think it sounds just about as good as most other songs I hear on the radio. If we were supposed to judge the song, I can't really give an opinion. You would probably want to post this file in the Hip Hop forum. See what those guys think.

[mallcore pop]

Okay, let me try this again:

Originally posted by alphadelta80
...I think we were supposed to give our opinion on the mix itself. If that's the case, I think it sounds just about as good as most other songs I hear on the radio.

I should hope so, because the track he used, "Watch Out Now" by the Beatnuts, was all over the radio (and later slaughtered by Jennifer Ho-pez on "Jenny From The Block")!

The off-key a cappella is from Lumidee's "Never Leave", and combined with call-and-answer sing-rap duets, and the moronic chipmunk bullcrap dominating the airwaves it represents the best that current hip-pop has to offer.

Originally posted by alphadelta80
If we were supposed to judge the song, I can't really give an opinion. You would probably want to post this file in the Hip Hop forum. See what those guys think.

Only the rapping was Vin-Su's, and I commented that I like his flow. Anyhoo, if you need me I'll be across the street.

[EleKtriKaz]

mallcore pop is right...lumidee's vocals are off-key on the original song too. I didn't really get it, every time I heard the song all I could think of was that she was off, but maybe that's the new thing. Who knows.

Not much of rap fan here either...but I liked Vin-Su's flow as well.

[Vin-Su]

Funny that most of you mention Lumidee was off key, look what i found in ana article the other day...


"Lumidee said that her vocals sound off key because the were actually recorded over another track. "Basically, he DJ Tedsmooth just broke the whole beat down," Lumidee says. "He played the whole beat over, and it sounds like I'm almost singing it to the beat. But it's the same vocals from almost two years ago, so it's just a blend. So like when people be like, 'It's off key. It's hot but it's like off key.' It's cause it's off key cause I didn't sing it on the track.""