How can I get phat drums for a metal song??

[Crayon Boy]

Recently started recording a "death metal" band. We finished the tracking and editing and we're now to the mixing stage. I've been having trouble getting a phat drum sound without turning them up too loud and overpowering the guitars. There seems to be a power/volume struggle between the drummer and guitarists... the drummer wanting a phat/powerful sound while the guitar players just want to be heard. In my opinion the guitars need to be up loud in the mix considering the kind of music, but I do want the drums to sound phat and powerful. Any tips? I am thinking lots of reverb will help. What else can I do?? Also, they insisted on laying down three guitar tracks... two panned out to the right and left and one in the center. In my opinion they only need two panned out, but they want to keep the center track as well. This seems to muddy up the mix a bit and make everything harder... any suggestions???

[Fox]

It varies from band to band, and on what the band wants, but in a lot of metal recordings the impact sound (or 'click', for the bass drum) is accentuated. Eq'ing the frequencies around the impact and click sounds may help bring out the drums while avoiding a volume struggle with the guitar mix.

[Son of Mixerman]

Fattening up the drums starts with a kit thats properly tuned, then it comes to mic choice next, and some eq so highlight the good characteristics. Compression and limiting works well. I use a plate reverb on the snare and kick but let the toms stay. Make sure the guitars are eq'd to nest in between the vox and the drums. keep tweaking it in small steps. Most new metal bands want detuned guitars for a heavy sound, but detuned guitars are rarely tight. Listen to Korn, their guitars sound like distorted bass'.

Are these guys practicing alot and doing gigs? IF they are then the band should probably not be making comments on how loud something is. I almost fried my headphone amp because a I had a metal band in 2 weeks ago who played a gig the night before and couldn't hear a nuclear attack if it was in their pants.

Pull the drums up 1st, get the levels right, then bring up the bass guitars slowly. once you get that groove going on bring up the main guitar up the middle or panned a tad. Bring up the vox until it nests. Lastly bring up the hard panned other guitars slowly until they are meshed well with what you have already going. I would also sqaush the guitars a bunch. To me compression is like a good hair gel, your keep woking it until it looks the way it should.



P.S I got a great kick tone recently on a double setup because the floor tom mic got moved accidently so it was pointing at the beater side from about 4 feet back and 3 feet off the ground. I might try it on purpose with a pair of sdc's.

Peace,
SoMm

[Bulls Hit]

Or use trigger software like Drumagog to blend prerecorded fat sounds with the real drums

[Wireneck]

Bullshit is right on the money. Unfortunately most metal bands these days are using some form of triggered drums or replacing their sounds in something like drumagog. Alot of bands hear this generic drum sound and don't even realize that its triggered.
I listen to many types of metal but have never been a big fan of the triggered drum sound.
It is hard to say without actually hearing the mix but I suspect that the guitar track up the middle is just going to clutter things in the mix. (unless it is a lead) Especially if this is a "true" death metal band with low growling vocals.
I would pan the guitars at 3 and 9 to give them some depth but also keep them up front. Thats where I like mine normally but i guess it all really depends.

[nascentjunkie]

well i know what your talking about, i have a metal band in my studio right now!! ha.... Anyway, what i did was make sure there was a lot of attack on the drum sounds. Kick i raised at about 2.5 k with a graph type eq and i changed the Q to about .6 which broadens the range around that center freq. so that is sounded more real as apposed to just raising 2.5k. Then i like to still have alot of bottom so it sounds heavy, (62hz) then i wanted it to be a bit more bright so i pop up 5 db at 8k. This will give it almost a metallica sound, like on reload and load(the 8 k that is) So if you don't want quite as much click sound, then just turn it down, but it has balls!! Also don't forget to compress it... Now next onto the snare. I found that i like to simply first compress the hell out of it... Then eq wise i raise 2.5-3k and a lot and on a tight scale. That way you get alot of snap sound and it really breaks through the mix WITHOUT HAVING TO RAISE TOO MUCH VOLUME!! Another tool that helps kinda set the snare in nicely is reverb. Listen to some of your favorite comercial bands and commercial death metal bands, there are some once in a while that almost burry the snare in reverb and it gives it that polished/compressed sound. It can be a very nice tool if your working with a not so talented drummer... back to eq... Then i give it some more low end so it doesn't sound like your hitting a wall...(150-300hz). Overheads i like to be very crisp sounding. So i lower anything below 500hz and give it a bit more sparkle sound by giving it some more treble. I also give the cymbals a bit of compression, but a very low ratio, say.... 2:1 or even lower. Just enough to take the edge off the drummers crappy playing... ha! toms i just make very full but with a lot of attakc(just mess around with these). Then something else i always do is record with a stereo pair of room mics. This just increases realism and sometimes i just use these instead of a hi-hat mic or ride even. It bascially all depends on how it sounds, but being your stereo micing you will still get that spread or pan of hi-hat and ride. (left right) And just remeber compression is your friend here, dont use to much or you will think your sounds are squashed, but too little and you will have mega problems having the drums sound very powerfull because they won't be at the same db level every hit... Bascially your trying to get that consistant sound. So i hope this helps a bit, and just remeber most of these settings i only use for metal and hard rock otherwise in a normal mix it might sound a bit weird or too polished almost. Now with those guitars, tell them that the idea of putting in a third track up the middle is the worst idea i have ever heard... Especially for metal. I pan mine close to hard right and left, but not too much that it sounds weird. Also bass gutiar is a very important thing here! This is what gives you that hard rock numetal sound. Make it thick, make it bassy!! But still don't forget a bit of presence. And for guitars eq wise i like to raise 2.5k to give make it sound more clear in the mix. and drop a bit of lows. Not too much! but a bit just to let the bass do its job(bass...) Good luck!