Newbie question on 414 connections.

[lady1001]

Hi All,

I just bought an older 414 which does not have XLR connectons. I currently have all my mics plugged into a Mackie mixer. Here's the question. In the manual it states you can plug a mixer into the Sub inputs on the back of the 424 but that it goes directly to the master fader. It seems to me that this would bypass the tracks. Can I just hook the L and R main outs of the mixer to the track 1 and 2 inputs of the 414 or is this a problem? A second option is to go into tracks 5/6 and 7/8 but Im really sure how this works My idea is to just record tracks one and two with background and then go to three and four for the vocals. The only other option I can see is to buy 1/4 plugs for my mics and then go into the line inputs for the tracks. Bear with me guys, I'm just learning.

Thanks

[DigitalSmigital]

I am better at asking questions than at answering, and I've only asked one! But here goes...

I think the signal from the channel inputs go through the strips to the master fader, so that you can EQ them and "pan" it to the desired buss. But your mixer has already done that for you, so you go from the Subs directly to the master fader, and on to whichever buss(es) is/are active. (be it L, R, or both for stereo)And then printed to tape. But this would seem to preclude the option of direct mode recording with your mixer while using the Sub inputs.

Is this true?

I have used a mixer and brought the signals (in stereo) on two channel strips with 1/4 in. jacks. As long as it's a line level output from the mixer, you should be OK.

Signal routing can be fun, and we can all benefit from the guys around here.

[lady1001]

Thanks for the answer. I see what you are saying. I guess I will just plug the Mackie's left and right main outputs to channel strips 1 and 2 for the background and switch them over to 3 and 4 for the vocals.

[Mark7]

As a former 414 (Mk I) owner I'd say you'd be better off plugging the Mackie's Outputs into two of the 414's four channel inputs and leaving the 414's Trim control right down.

Use the Direct mode (arm tracks 1 and 2) to print to tracks 1 and 2, then use the LR mode (arm tracks 3 and 4: with the appropriate panning on each of the two 414 channels you're plugged into) to print to tracks 3 and 4

The manual will explain the right way to set it up, if you have one.

[Mark7]

What kind of Mackie do you have?

[lady1001]

I have a 1642-VLZ. Nice mixer. Up until now I have only used it for live sound. The manual I have is for the MKII so its probably a little different that the one for the original 414. My manual doesn't really address the use of a outboard mixer or explain it very well.

[Mark7]

The 1642 has four Aux Outs doesn't it? Why don't you try hooking up each Aux Out to a 414 Channel Input, set each track in direct record and use the Buss Assigns (the buttons labelled 1-2 and 3-4 next to each fader) on the mixer to send the instruments to the different Aus Sends?

[The Ghost of FM]

Your Portastudio's manual probably doesn't address what you want to do because what you are doing is a little beyond what the 414 was designed to do.

The 414 already has a mixer in it and is aimed at users who will be using it.

You seem to want to not use a good chunk of it because it doesn't have the balanced inputs that your microphone cables offer as a connection.

From a logistics point of view, it might far simpilar an easier for you, the end user, to just get the required amount of adapters for your microphones and plug them in directly to the Portastudio's Mic inputs. This way, you will reduce the inevitable extra noise build up that will occur by using twice as much circuitry to get the job done.

If you were using the Mackie mixer because you needed all those channel strips to Mic up a drum kit or a very large vocal ensemble that required more Mic inputs then the 414 allowed for, then I could see the practical use of doing what you are trying to accomplish.

Perhaps the smarter route to have taken was not to buy a portastudio in the first place and perhaps you should have just bought a 4 track straight recorder and hooked that up to the Mackie directly, thus shortening your signal path. Or, the other alternative might have been to sell the Mackie if you no longer have a real use for it and simply relied on the Portastudio's mixer to handle your mixing/routing needs.

Adapters for XLR to quarter inch microphones are readily available and are as low as 10 bucks a piece. They would accomplish and simplify the task of connecting your Mic's directly to the 414 and shorten your signal path.

Good luck with your sound!

Cheers!

[Mark7]

You might be better off trading in the 414 for a well maintained TEAC 3340 or Tascam 34B (both Reel to Reel 4 tracks) or even the Tascam 234 (rackmount cassette 4 track) or 238 (rack mount cassette 8 track); any of which you should be able to get for less than 300 clams.

[lady1001]

Thank you all for the information. I think I will go with the adapter route. That sounds the easiest. I really don't need a mixer the size of the Mackie. There are only two of us. I play the instrumentals(guitar-bass), we use a drum sampler and then we have the vocals. I mic my amps and vocals through the Mackie to a two track. I can get the background and vocals on the two track but when we need a lead or second vocal we of course need the multitrack. That' why I got the 414, to add that additional track.

[lady1001]

Mark7
I have been looking at the adapters and cords that go from an XLR input to 1/4. The adapters are XLR to 1/4 BALANCED. The cord is XLR to 1/4 UNBALANCED. Does it make any differnece between the two for plugging my mics into the 414 mic/line inputs?

[The Ghost of FM]

What you actually need is a balancing transformer adapter.

They contain a transformer that allows a balanced, XLR connector on one end of the adapter and a quarter inch mono/TS plug on the other end of it. This adapter connects in-between your existing Mic cable and the Portastudio's Mic input. You can keep and use your existing Mic cables.

Both Shure and Radioshack sell the adapters.

You can not use a TRS plug into the Portastudio's Mic input. The pin assignments wouldn't work as far as I am aware.

Perhaps Mark can confirm this for you.

Cheers!

[lady1001]

Thank you for all of the help. I'll look into the balancing transformer adapter. Without you guys I'd be lost. In reading the manual they don't say anything about needing anything. They just say "Plug your mic in the the mic/line input and off you go" I knew it couldn't be that simple LOL!

[radiorickm]

here's the thing...
the transformers are one more piece of electic equipment that causes a loss of signal and induces it's own distortion into the signal chain.

in this case, you don't HAVE to adapt from one plug type to the other.

my bet is you would be better off just using a high qaulity 1/4 cable. non trs.

[Mark7]

You can buy Female XLR to Male 1/4" cables easily enough.