4x10 cabinet "breaking up"

[Mr. Moon]

4x10 cabinet "breaking up"

The sorted tale continues....

So, I have my new-used 4x10 cabinet (Marshall 1965B cab, loaded with four (4) 8-ohm 10-inch 35-watt speakers; 8-ohms total impedance) and my Marshall ValveState 100 (100-watt @ 4 ohms) head. I plug in my guitar and start playing for a while at low volumes in all 3 channels (clean, OD1, and OD2), and it sounds great!! Then I crank it up a bit, and it still sounds sweet!

...But then I crank it up loud enough to compete with the drummer I'm working with and the speakers start "breaking up" to the point that the sound is very flat and overly distorted and sounds like mush. When I play with the drummer using the same head through a Marshall VS412A 4x12 cabinet, the sound is much better at loud volumes, but still breaks up enough to piss me off.

What I am looking for is a cabinet that can handle the power at volume, and have a "darker" tone overall. I used to have a rig with a Marshall 1960A 4x12 cabinet, but I remember it sounding to "mid-rangy" to me at all volumes. I traded that cab in for a 5150 Peavey cab, which sounded perfect, but as these cabs are set at 16-ohms, I worry that my Marshall will not have enough wattage to push it.

So, what I'm looking for is a cabinet that can handle a lot of volume and deep guitar tone (drop-C and standard 7 string tuning), without breaking up. I still have time to return the 4x10 cabinet and get something else, so if I need to ditch it, it will not be the end of the world or anything.

Any suggestions?

Thanks!

-Mr. Moon

[matty_boy]

I think it is the head that is the problem. Valvestates sound alright at low volumes (to me) but shart to sound harsh when turned up loud.

[Mr. Moon]

Originally posted by matty_boy
I think it is the head that is the problem. Valvestates sound alright at low volumes (to me) but shart to sound harsh when turned up loud.

Geeeezzzzz.... I'm an idiot. I never thought about that. I was too caught up thinking that it was the cab rather than the amp. Maybe the 4x12 cab that I was using to jam with just masked it a bit more ....not to mention the loud drums that may have been masking the sound.

I will have to try another amp through it to find out, I guess.

Thanks!

-Mr. Moon

[matty_boy]

Hope it works out. I always turn my valvestate down a but to record it, and it turns out OK IMO.

[McButtsky]

Yeh, playing guitar through a bass cab is never going to sound good. You wont cut through at all. I used to play a 7 string drop tuned to A with a Marshall 1960A slant cab with no problems at all, always sounded nice and thick, but i was using a 5150II. I'd say to upgrade your amp and cab. I love my 5150II cos it gives me all i need apart from MIDI but i may invest in a JMP1 and 100/100 power amp for that, but for studio work, the peavey gets me from a to b quite happily. The best cab i've heard was a Mesa Recto cab with celestian V30's in it. Had a really nice deep tone and chugged like something brutal. those cabs are a shade under £1000 over here though, so maybe a Marshall cab with V30's would be a good alternative, although im pretty sure they're expensive in the states.

[Mr. Moon]

Originally posted by McButtsky
Yeh, playing guitar through a bass cab is never going to sound good. You wont cut through at all. I used to play a 7 string drop tuned to A with a Marshall 1960A slant cab with no problems at all, always sounded nice and thick, but i was using a 5150II. I'd say to upgrade your amp and cab. I love my 5150II cos it gives me all i need apart from MIDI but i may invest in a JMP1 and 100/100 power amp for that, but for studio work, the peavey gets me from a to b quite happily. The best cab i've heard was a Mesa Recto cab with celestian V30's in it. Had a really nice deep tone and chugged like something brutal. those cabs are a shade under £1000 over here though, so maybe a Marshall cab with V30's would be a good alternative, although im pretty sure they're expensive in the states.

The cab I have is one of the mini-stack cabs that Marshall had out a decade or more ago. Here's info about them:

The Mini Stack concept was introduced in 1984. The Mini Stack cabinets were smaller 4x10" or 2x12" versions of the normal 4x12" cabinets. The heads were downsized accordingly to fit. 1965A, 4x10" Mini Stack Cabinet, angled front.
1965B, 4x10" Mini Stack Cabinet, straight front.
These mini stack cabinets were intoduced in 1984 and discontinued in 1991. They were fitted with four 10" Celestion speakers.

Found here: www.drtube.com/marshall.htm#MINISTACK


I have the 1965B model, and the reviews at harmony-central have been really good on the 1965 cab, so I thought I'd give it a shot. Sounds great on the the Trademark 10 and Marshall at low volumes, but the Trademark 10 cannot push it loud enough, and the Marshall appears to crap out when you push it too loud. ...Further proof that Murphy's Law *is* alive and well in my life!!

I wish I had enough money to purchase the gear that I'd like, but alas, I have other things like food and such that have the priority spot for now. Any other low-cost (~$250.00 (US) used) options would be appreciated. I only need this rig for practice and live situations, as my trademark 10 works perfectly for recording!

Thanks!

-Mr. Moon

[matty_boy]

Sorry man, I wish it would have worked out better for you. I ahve the same problem when playing with a drummer.

[Dethska]

You might try a Sovtek Mig100. I'm not sure exactly what tone you are looking for, but it gets really loud. And to my ear, it has a "darker" tone. It might be a little muddy for you though. I used it with Drop B tuning in my last band and got a sound I was happy with.

They have been discontinued but can be found fairly cheap on ebay. Might be worth a look.

[Mr. Moon]

I don't want to bore you with the details, but I returned the Valvestate 100 head due to the breaking up issue, and decided to hold on to the 4x10 cabinet for recording with my Trademark 10.

Long story short: After searching high and low locally for something else, I stumbled into a *mint-condition* used Marshall JCM2000 DSL 100-watt head at the local Guitar Satan. I talked the manager down from $750.00+tax to $700.00 after tax.

I no longer suffer from the 4x10 cabinet breaking-up, even when I play loud enough to dislodge the ceiling texture-paint stuff so that it falls like snow!!

Next, I will look for the perfect 4x12 cabinet in a few months when the pocketbook allows for it, but I'm good for now!!

-Mr. Moon

[Fusion2]

good, good, good,...good vibrations vibration does a amp head good... milk also...

[Mr. Moon]

Originally posted by Fusion2
good, good, good,...good vibrations vibration does a amp head good... milk also...

It should be noted that the head sits *alongside* the cabinet on its own little stand, as it won't fit on the 4x10 properly and it would jostle itself off the cab in about 2 seconds due to the sonic vibes produced!!

...Now I'll have to re-name this thread "Eardrums Breaking up!!"

-Mr. Moon

[Fusion2]

Originally posted by Mr. Moon
It should be noted that the head sits *alongside* the cabinet on its own little stand, as it won't fit on the 4x10 properly and it would jostle itself off the cab in about 2 seconds due to the sonic vibes produced!!

...Now I'll have to re-name this thread "Eardrums Breaking up!!"

-Mr. Moon

it's true though been there, done "learned" that... in 1977...

good, good, good,...good vibrations...