in/out phase switch preamp

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davecg321

New member
hi all

just a real quick question.

on my microphone preamp there is an in/out phase switch. i assume it should be on the "in" setting for normal recording purposes...? forgive my naivety

dave
 
davecg321 said:
hi all

just a real quick question.

on my microphone preamp there is an in/out phase switch. i assume it should be on the "in" setting for normal recording purposes...? forgive my naivety

dave
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I could make a logical guess and assume that IN means the phase is reversed and OUT means that phase is left unchanged, but it would be nearly impossible for us to know without knowing what preamp you have. Perhaps the preamp manual could give you some insight as to which setting is "normal".

On the other hand, the phase setting doesn't matter much unless you mix the recorded track with another identical or closely similar track.
 
Hi Dave,
Although there's a right and a wrong your microphone, cable, and preamp could, realistically, be wired either which way.
So really it becomes relative. You'd only adjust the polarity relative to that of another microphone so all I can recommend is listening carefully and A/Bing to see what's what.

Don't panic if you record with the switch set wrong. You can always invert polarity in your software anyway. :)
If you're just recording one source with one mic, it literally doesn't matter.
 
RawDepth said:
I could make a logical guess and assume that IN means the phase is reversed and OUT means that phase is left unchanged, but it would be nearly impossible for us to know without knowing what preamp you have. Perhaps the preamp manual could give you some insight as to which setting is "normal".

On the other hand, the phase setting doesn't matter much unless you mix the recorded track with another identical or closely similar track.
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Not that it matters that much (most of the time) as others here have stated, but I would assume the opposite regarding the switch - "In" mean In Phase and "Out" mean Out of Phase.
 
I would assume 'in' means in phase and 'out' means out of phase. That would make more sense in this context.

Absolute phase only matters in the context of multiple microphones picking up the same (more or less) signal. For example, if you had a mic on the top and bottom of a snare drum, you would reverse the phase on the bottom mic in order to get the signal going the same direction as the top mic's signal.

Other than situations like that, it doesn't matter at all.
 
bLUiVORY said:
Not that it matters that much (most of the time) as others here have stated, but I would assume the opposite regarding the switch - "In" mean In Phase and "Out" mean Out of Phase.
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"In phase" with what? ...itself? ...the source? ...another mic? How would it know that?

My thoughts follow the same logic as on/off labeling found on other gear such as, EQ-in/out or Pad-in/out. But again, who knows? I'm just guessing.
 
I think "In Phase" implies that the sound source will start with it's wave in the positive side.

Of course...when it's multiple mics, then "In Phase can also mean relative to each other, but I would think the markings on the preamp are not talking about that, as there would be no way for the preamp to know that. :)
 
RawDepth said:
"In phase" with what? ...itself? ...the source? ...another mic? How would it know that?

My thoughts follow the same logic as on/off labeling found on other gear such as, EQ-in/out or Pad-in/out. But again, who knows? I'm just guessing.
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In phase with what is coming from the mic. I get what you are saying, and it would make sense if the thing were labeled "phase reverse". If it's labeled just 'phase', In phase would have the signal coming out of the preamp in phase with the signal going in. Out of phase would have the signal coming out of the preamp out of phase with the signal going in.
 
I wouldn't be too phased by it.

The only time it's gonna' make much of a difference is if you're using one of these...
phaser.png
 
I think it means whatever anyone wants it to mean. :D

Yeah...you can say that too...I was just thinking that most sound sources start their "in phase" on the positive side unless they've been electronically flipped...and at that point two things can be "in phase" with each other polarity-wise, and still out of phase with everything else. :p
 
I assume you would like to know what 'in phase' and 'reverse phase' means.
You can record using either but say you are putting down a vocal track and you need to double up on a 2nd track. One recorded 'in phase' and the other 'reverse phase' will sound more like two separate vocals than a pair of in or reverse phased tracks. I record in phase all the time but this is because I'm a rubbish vocalist and so no two vocal tracks are ever identical.
 
The Uninvited said:
One recorded 'in phase' and the other 'reverse phase' will sound more like two separate vocals than a pair of in or reverse phased tracks.
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Not true at all. Unless the performances are exactly identical, which is almost impossible, it won't matter one bit. "Phase" is about 2 identical signals, not 2 separate performances, even if it's the same part trying to be duplicated. If you clone or copy the same performance to another track and switch the polarity on one of them, then you'll hear a difference. They'll actually cancel each other out. But singing twice and flipping one of them does nothing at all.
 
+1.
If your two separate performances are tight enough to cause cancellation at any point, which does happen, reversing polarity of one will prevent or alter that cancellation but, the odds are, it'll allow it to happen elsewhere or in a different way.

There's no predictable relationship with two separate parts and, really, the only way to find out if it's going to sound different at all is to try it.

The only reason I can see to do so would be curiosity.
 
Steenamaroo said:
+1.
If your two separate performances are tight enough to cause cancellation at any point, which does happen, ....
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It happens, but it's rare. I've had it happen to me at a rate of about one syllable every 20 complete songs. Almost never. But it can happen.
 
RAMI said:
It happens, but it's rare. I've had it happen to me at a rate of about one syllable every 20 complete songs. Almost never. But it can happen.
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I'm kinda surprised 'cos your vocals are so damn tight man.
I hear it sometimes on held notes.

If you wide pan or offset the volumes by default you're a lot less likely to notice it.
I guess that's why we wide pan, or reduce the volume of one take in mixing.

Nirvana were mad for that. If you ever hear the vocals from In Bloom solod out, or even the backing vocals, you'd swear there was a chorus plug on there!
 
Steenamaroo said:
I'm kinda surprised 'cos your vocals are so damn tight man.
I hear it sometimes on held notes.
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Thanx Steen. Not as tight as you think. :D

No, I have heard it happen, but if anything, I might hear a slight chorusing on a held note, but almost never a cancelling out. And that chorusing will happen even if I flip the phase (polarity). I usually pan my 2 vocals a teenage c**t hair apart, like about 5% to each side.
 
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More and more bits of kit are now labelling and describing these switches as polarity, as this is accurate. For year we've referred to them, and used the symbol for phase. They've never been a phase switch in what they actually do. I guess it never mattered before because we didn;t have equipment that could actually move two tracks one against the other in time that minute. Now we do. A polarity switch would have to be labeled normal or reversed, which helps no end. We insist on still using the old term for the wrong thing, and it's no wonder people get confused. Polarity is polarity, and phase refers to time shifts in degrees. Separating them is sensible now technology is more precise in it's abilities.
 
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