What nut lubricant do you use?

I just got my first guitar with locking tuners. Those things freaking rock, and they make changing strings so much quicker! With standard tuners, I try to keep the winds around the post to a minimum, but I don't always get it right. And it can be maddening to get the tuning stable as the winds settle. With the locking tuners, it's just a set-and-forget kind of thing. I love 'em. Now I want them on all of my guitars.

My LP is usually pretty stable, but the G string is definitely the one that'll give me the most trouble.
 
I can see why locking tuners make string changing quicker/easier....but I don't get why some people think that with non-locking tuners, strings will "slip" out of tune....?

I've never seen strings slip, not matter how much playing/bending I do.
I always cut the strings neatly to length, do a few winds (how many, depends on the string's gauge). I only leave about 1/2" of string sticking out of the hole, and then I just bend that around the post.
I've never done any of the over/under/twist/fold "tricks" some people use when stringing....or the so called "Pro Wrap"...etc.

I mean, if the strings actually slipped...at some point the end would pull out of the hole....but that's never, ever happened, and I tend not to change strings too often, so they get a lot of play and bending, etc.
The one thing that I always do when re-stringing, is to stretch new strings quite a bit. I mean, I really work them several times, and keep checking the tuning. If I stretch a string and it goes flat, I keep repeating that until the tuner shows that it's holding tune even after a stretch. Once that's set.....they don't go out of tune because of any string "slipping".
There's other factors that could make strings go out of tune.

AFA as the G string tuning issue that many guitars seem to have...I've adopted a variation on the typical intonation process of using the harmonic and the 12th fret.
Instead I simply set the intonation by checking the tuning at the 5th and 17th frets (no harmonics). I set the bridge saddles so that the tuning at those two frets is as equally in-tune as possible. Most times I can get both almost perfect....or at worst, they'll be equally out of tune, but that's never more than a couple of clicks on the strobe tuner, and that small equal offset at both positions, allows the string to still be generally in-tune across the whole neck, better than when just using the 12th fret/harmonic approach...IMO.

The other "trick" for the G string that I've found helps is at the pickup.
If you have pickups with magnet adjusting screws...lower the G string screw by 1/2 to 2 turns. You'll have to experiment what works for your guitar and pickup.
When they are set evenly for a pickup...often the G string still sounds more prominent, it tends to boom out, and has a tendency to be or sound louder than D or B/E...so then if there is any slight tuning issue with the G, it just sticks out even more because of that.

The point is to slightly lower the output of the G string a bit. I find the point where the G-string output is lowered, but not so that it sounds too low...rather to that point where it blends j-u-s-t a little "under" the others level-wise, and without that typical G-string boom.
I find that helps keep any G string tuning issues from sounding as obvious.
 
The strings don't continually keep slipping around the post. They just take a little bit to settle their grip around the post after a string change. I've had them slip quite a bit when I've made an error while restringing. Especially the plain strings. Every once in a while, I'll just about have it to pitch then "brroiiiinnggg" it slips and the string pitch drops several half-steps. Definitely user error while winding. But that's definitely not the string stretching.

When I changed my strings the first time on my Tele with locking tuners, I really didn't have to do any of the "stretching". The strings were in-tune and stable after just a few full-step bends. Which makes me think that most of the tuning instability that I experience after each string change on my other guitars is the strings settling their grip around the post. I mean, that's really the only place in the system where tension could be lost, right?
 
Yeah...there's probably some initial settling/tightening around the post, and of course, the strings can/will stretch some when new, and when first tightening/tuning, you can get that "brroiiiinnggg"...so the intentional stretching of new strings gets all that to settle in.

I just keep seeing people talk about strings "slipping" from around the posts, and that's whey they feel they need locking tuners....but I've yet to see that happen. Like I said, I cut mine short, and if there was constant slipping, it would eventually slip out of the post....but that never happens.

I really like the tuners that have the vertical hole going down the post and a full or half cut slot rather than the hole on the side....like Fenders and some other brands.
You slide the end into the vertical hole, bend the string down in the slot, and then wind it. No sharp end sticking out, and they lock down real good without the use of an actual lock mechanism.
 
miroslav said:
I really like the tuners that have the vertical hole going down the post and a full or half cut slot rather than the hole on the side....like Fenders and some other brands.
You slide the end into the vertical hole, bend the string down in the slot, and then wind it. No sharp end sticking out, and they lock down real good without the use of an actual lock mechanism.
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Yup, stick it in the hole, and twist! That's what she said.



No slipping. Ever.
 
Tadpui said:
Nice. I haven't ever had a guitar with those, so I still don't quite get it...I'd have to play with it myself to see how it works.
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Like I said earlier measure the string to the next tuning post cut it right at that point. Insert the end in the hole and twist. You will end up with around two turns. Same method without the post hole on the top just do the same but feed the string through the normal hole and kink the string as it exits the hole near the end. It takes me around 3 minutes to restring a guitar but I do use a string winder when I'm at the bench.

This isn't rocket science and please every one lets not go down that string slipping on the post debate again, quite simply it doesn't happen.
 
Tadpui said:
Nice. I haven't ever had a guitar with those, so I still don't quite get it...I'd have to play with it myself to see how it works.
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It's simple. Extend the string to the tuner past the one you're working on. Snip it off there. Stick the end in the hole, whip it around, twist. Bam. Done. Roughly two wraps, no slipping.

Same with the standard ass Klusons. No slip.
 
Whatever helps you through the night.... :D

OK...we both accept the engineering mechanics and mechanical physics.
 
Like I said. It sounds counter intuitive. Try it before denying it.

The extra wraps do create more downward friction. The increased downward friction overcomes the lateral friction caused by the G string's travel direction to the post due to its location.

Posted by Greg_L:
"I'm of the opinion, just my own reasoning and stuff I've read, that the G string on the LP/SG is problematic because of the headstock shape and where the tuning pegs are located. The G string crosses the nut and makes a relatively sharp kink to reach it's tuning peg. The D string does the same, but being thicker, and wound, the kick doesn't affect it as much. Firebirds and Vs don't have this issue because they don't use the standard open-book Gibson headstock shape and the strings take a straighter shot to the tuning pegs. Is any of that truth? It just seems that way to me."

That is true with my observations and experience as well.

Posted by muttley600:
"The fixed points on a string are the tuning post and the stop bar. The nut and saddle act as fulcrums and the string needs to be able to pass over them smoothly or bends will result in sticking and slipping. The tension in the string has to remain constant for it to maintain pitch. The coefficient of friction is also constant but the downward force increases it's effect. Hard to explain but thats why people use lubricants, to reduce that coefficient."

Adjusting the break angles at the bridge or at the nut redistributes balance of tension at those two points while keeping the string tension between nut and saddle constant. What happens if you raise the stop bar? It reduces downward force on the saddles. How does that happen without reducing tension somewhere between the stop bar and the tuning posts? Then, if you lower the stop bar it increases downward force. How does that happen without increasing tension somewhere between the the stop bar and the tuning posts?

If you introduce extreme angles and friction like you would on a blocked trem Strat, pivot action is basically eliminated and the saddle virtually ceases to act as a fulcrum and then behaves more like a fixed anchor point. So then, all the tension play is between the tuning post and the saddles. Unlike a Gibson where the tension play is always going to be between the tuning post and the tailpiece. Unless of course you crank the bridge up high and floor the tailpiece.

It is a balancing act. Not a myth.
 
Not My Name said:
Like I said. It sounds counter intuitive. Try it before denying it.
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I don't need to try it. I can assure you that I have enough experience to know the reality as well as enough education to understand the science.

Adjusting the break angles at the bridge or at the nut redistributes balance of tension at those two points while keeping the string tension between nut and saddle constant.
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What does this even mean? As I explained, tension is a component of the mass per unit length, frequency or pitch and length of a string. Nothing else is a factor. The forces you elude to act around the fulcrum points and are dependent on the moments of the forces acting at those points. Newton explains this rather well. Read up

What happens if you raise the stop bar? It reduces downward force on the saddles. How does that happen without reducing tension somewhere between the stop bar and the tuning posts? Then, if you lower the stop bar it increases downward force. How does that happen without increasing tension somewhere between the the stop bar and the tuning posts?
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By reducing or increasing the break angle at the fulcrum points all you do is increase or decrease the friction coefficient acting at that point making the string either more or less free to pass over that point. You DO NOT change the tension in the string or the relationship between the tension in either part of the string. Simple physics.


If you introduce extreme angles and friction like you would on a blocked trem Strat, pivot action is basically eliminated and the saddle virtually ceases to act as a fulcrum and then behaves more like a fixed anchor point. So then, all the tension play is between the tuning post and the saddles. Unlike a Gibson where the tension play is always going to be between the tuning post and the tailpiece. Unless of course you crank the bridge up high and floor the tailpiece.
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I have no idea what your point is here but it has absolutely nothing to do with string tension.

It is a balancing act. Not a myth
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The idea that by increasing or decreasing the break angle alters the tension in the string or the relationship between the parts of the string is a myth. Physics is your friend and I don't care what your intuition may tell you. The ONLY thing you alter is the direction i9n which the combined force acts in.

You are not from Long Island are you?
 
Greg_L said:
None of that explains how more wraps keeps a nut from binding. Maybe I missed it.
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His implication was that by adding more winds on the post you slightly increase the break angle over the nut as the fixed point would be lower on the tuning post. It's a nonsense.
 
miroslav said:
Whatever helps you through the night.... :D

OK...we both accept the engineering mechanics and mechanical physics.
Click to expand...

I was merely pointing out that this isn't my idea or opinion it's just plan science. For any one to disagree with it would put them in the VP end of the spectrum. I wasn't suggesting you are that far over yet..;)
 
Ah hah. Stupid me. KISS

Adding extra wraps is basically like adding a string tree. Whatever forces are at work here, be they mythical or reality based, help keep the string more taut behind the nut so that when a bend is released there is more pull coming from the post which makes binding less likely to occur. The looser the string sits in the slot the more susceptible it is to bunching up and binding when releasing a bend.
 
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