Untrained singer looking for feedback

Thanks man.

For the first verse, I struggled for a very long time even finding a vocal melody/lyrics. If you play keyboard, guitar, or sing, I'd be really interested into hearing your vocal melody ideas.

I'm actually surprised to hear so many comments on the tuning. A lot of pop punk bands I listen to have highly tuned vocals. I personally don't mind it, but I understand where you guys are coming from. I'm not much of a singer to be honest, and I don't like my voice unless it's tuned to death. But like I said, I will be taking singing lessons soon, and hopefully will improve that area. I will also go easier on the tuning for my new songs. I had actually never recorded singing vocals before, so these 3 songs are my first rock songs. I used to rap.

The music isn't actually slowing down at the end of the first chorus, it's just that the drum pattern changes.

Thanks for the criticism, it really is helpful and I appreciate it.
 
Big Thier said:
Thanks man.

For the first verse, I struggled for a very long time even finding a vocal melody/lyrics. If you play keyboard, guitar, or sing, I'd be really interested into hearing your vocal melody ideas.

I'm actually surprised to hear so many comments on the tuning. A lot of pop punk bands I listen to have highly tuned vocals. I personally don't mind it, but I understand where you guys are coming from. I'm not much of a singer to be honest, and I don't like my voice unless it's tuned to death. But like I said, I will be taking singing lessons soon, and hopefully will improve that area. I will also go easier on the tuning for my new songs. I had actually never recorded singing vocals before, so these 3 songs are my first rock songs. I used to rap.

The music isn't actually slowing down at the end of the first chorus, it's just that the drum pattern changes.

Thanks for the criticism, it really is helpful and I appreciate it.
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The instruments and drums both slow their pace, but the tempo is the same. There's definitely a rhythmic change there, though a quick one. I wish I didn't work tomorrow, or else I'd record the verse idea I had and send it to you... I actually was going to do this when I first posted, but the GF got home right then. Just to give you some ideas, because this music is right up my alley.

Like everyone said, I think, there generally isn't a problem with tuned music. The thing is though, we can get accustomed to our own stuff, and we lose objectivity, if it exists in music... but we lose that sense of listening from another perspective. Takes a lot of time and patience, stepping away and being painfully honest with yourself about what you're hearing.

But I'll tell ya, whoever is mixing the guitars and drums, and recording them to begin with, is doing a great job. The music sounds very good. The vocals too, except for the automated stuff that really stands out. I like your stuff, every song I listened to was my typical playlist type stuff. Ok, not typical, because there was something unique in it, and that guitar-writing/musical harmony was my jam. There's good arrangements in there and great guitar/music decisions. Just get them vocals going. :guitar:
 
I agree with Andru you have real ability. You just need to get over your insecurity. Practicing singing more, sing out of tune, or learn to tune the vocals more naturally because those artifacts are the main problem.
 
andrushkiwt said:
The instruments and drums both slow their pace, but the tempo is the same. There's definitely a rhythmic change there, though a quick one. I wish I didn't work tomorrow, or else I'd record the verse idea I had and send it to you... I actually was going to do this when I first posted, but the GF got home right then. Just to give you some ideas, because this music is right up my alley.

Like everyone said, I think, there generally isn't a problem with tuned music. The thing is though, we can get accustomed to our own stuff, and we lose objectivity, if it exists in music... but we lose that sense of listening from another perspective. Takes a lot of time and patience, stepping away and being painfully honest with yourself about what you're hearing.

But I'll tell ya, whoever is mixing the guitars and drums, and recording them to begin with, is doing a great job. The music sounds very good. The vocals too, except for the automated stuff that really stands out. I like your stuff, every song I listened to was my typical playlist type stuff. Ok, not typical, because there was something unique in it, and that guitar-writing/musical harmony was my jam. There's good arrangements in there and great guitar/music decisions. Just get them vocals going. :guitar:
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Thanks again! You're right about the "getting accustomed to our own stuff" part. By the point I send my uncorrected vocals to the pitch correction guy, I'm so used to the Auto-Tune automatic mode sound that I keep asking him to tune them harder.

I do all the mixing. I also write the lyrics and vocal melodies, and produce the whole thing. And I record the vocals. The main guitars in Close The Door and Straight To The End are composed and recorded by my band's guitarist. The drums are recorded by a session drummer, but composed by us.

I'm curious to know what bands you listen to.
 
Big Thier said:
I do all the mixing. I also write the lyrics and vocal melodies, and produce the whole thing. And I record the vocals. The main guitars in Close The Door and Straight To The End are composed and recorded by my band's guitarist. The drums are recorded by a session drummer, but composed by us.
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Get out of the habit of saying you do everything. It comes off as weird bragging. Once you are secure (musically) you don't do those things. Nobody is going to pat you on the back for playing, mixing, and releasing an album these days -- it's kinda par for the course with being a serious musician. Just saying for your own growth. Be humble, hone your craft daily, and help others where you can. It's the best way to go. I don't mean any offense just a piece of advice after reading that.
 
Nola said:
Get out of the habit of saying you do everything. It comes off as weird bragging. Once you are secure (musically) you don't do those things. Nobody is going to pat you on the back for playing, mixing, and releasing an album these days -- it's kinda par for the course with being a serious musician. Just saying for your own growth. Be humble, hone your craft daily, and help others where you can. It's the best way to go. I don't mean any offense just a piece of advice after reading that.
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Wasn't bragging as much as I was giving info to possibly help people identify the areas which I have the most control over. The vocals seem to be the weaklest link, and yes, I sang them.
 
Big Thier said:
Thanks again! You're right about the "getting accustomed to our own stuff" part. By the point I send my uncorrected vocals to the pitch correction guy, I'm so used to the Auto-Tune automatic mode sound that I keep asking him to tune them harder.

I do all the mixing. I also write the lyrics and vocal melodies, and produce the whole thing. And I record the vocals. The main guitars in Close The Door and Straight To The End are composed and recorded by my band's guitarist. The drums are recorded by a session drummer, but composed by us.

I'm curious to know what bands you listen to.
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Do you have the mixed music and raw vocals available to you? Send them my way, if you'd like. I actually got called off work today. I'd like to take a stab at it, but I'd want the entire mixed song but with raw vocals. Can even bounce everything aside from vox to a single track, if you're interested. I have Melodyne.

I listen to a lot of rock stuff. I was heavy into Rancid, Blink 182, MxPx, Sum41, Green Day, Less Than Jake, and all that stuff, but my gut is always with Nirvana. I like Anberlin a lot, Killswitch Engage, Trapt... I haven't kept up with what's out there now. Oh, A7X. Saw them a few times and have their autographs, even the drummer who died. Got that one a few weeks before he passed.

If you have those files, and are interested, PM me.

edit: Been listening all morning, and I have a few other thoughts I wanted to share, just in case. You need to start recording the really long lines with a hold on the end. Anywhere where there's a quick line after what you just sang, record them as two separate lines, so there's a hangover. Example: "...staring down - out on your porch". Hold the "down" and overlap the lines. You need to be creative and have a critical ear for when those kinds of things could occur, take advantage of those opportunities. It's used all the time in this music - the overhanging lines. Also, add harmonies and background vocals. They would take this up a few notches. I can hear so many of them during these choruses.
 
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Nola said:
Get out of the habit of saying you do everything. It comes off as weird bragging.
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I mean, he does, and it is difficult to do it well, which I think he's doing. He didn't mention it until I asked him something pertaining to it. Just because he's in the vocal forum (I know how we all feel about this sub, and we all remember why it was created) doesn't mean it's gonna be sub-par. I can learn from his guitar sound, and he needs help with vocals. Most of us here do our own thing all the way through. Aside from the vox, I think he's top notch around here. Nola, check out his guitars and the music mix.
 
I found this, for anybody who thinks that the deliberate autotune sound is old hat.

I know its not the OP's genre, but that god awful sound is still doing the rounds, and could end up anywhere.

That's why I get the "you don't know what you are talking about treatment, when I mention how crap it sounds to me to people I know".

 
Andrush: I’ll try to send you the raw vocals today. Also, there are actually harmony vocals all the way through the song exept the first half of the verses, but the level is so low that you can barely hear them. They’re panned about 40% each side and I find it creates bigger vocals even though in the final mix they’re really discreet.

Also, I’m surprised no one is bringing up the accent. Are you a native English speaker? My first language is French, and I think it’s quite obvious at times.
 
The accent didn't jump out at me at all, for what it's worth.
If you're next release is 'Ils ont changé ma chanson' it might be a different story. :p
 
andrushkiwt said:
I mean, he does, and it is difficult to do it well, which I think he's doing. He didn't mention it until I asked him something pertaining to it. Just because he's in the vocal forum (I know how we all feel about this sub, and we all remember why it was created) doesn't mean it's gonna be sub-par. I can learn from his guitar sound, and he needs help with vocals. Most of us here do our own thing all the way through. Aside from the vox, I think he's top notch around here. Nola, check out his guitars and the music mix.
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It's the 2nd time I saw him do it and the other time he did mention it without provocation, which is why I said something yesterday. He did it here: Original pop punk song (need mix feedback)
Original pop punk song (need mix feedback)

Hi, here is another song I would greatly appreciate feedback on.

I produced it, wrote the lyrics/vocal melody, recorded and sang the vocals, and mixed it. It's not mastered yet.
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I'm not trying to be a jerk, but I just happened to notice it again in this thread, and for his own growth as a musician felt I should tell him. I get being proud and all that and agreed he is doing a good job so far. Anyway! No hard feelings, BT.
 
I want to second what someone else said-that there are too many words in too little space in that first tune, try to rephrase the same lines with less words and the delivery will be easier. The auto tuning seems lazily done, like the whole track was selected and mass auto tuned rather than spot edited. As far as your recording habits go, hit "stop" when you know you hit a clunker and start again, do multiple takes and choose the best lines/phrases from each. Record verses in one go-choruses in another if needed. I can slow down the audio with my RME unit-record at a slightly lower tempo when doing vocals then put the speed back again...Don't let a mistake you can't live with into your mix in the first place.

And speaking of auto tune any of you guys ever play Saints row 3rd?

YouTube
 
Stratomaster said:
And speaking of auto tune any of you guys ever play Saints row 3rd?
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I couldn't get into that one, cause it seemed that GTA just did a much better job with it during that time period. I admit I do play a lot of CoD when not busy. Almost master prestige :) I'm not sure if I should be proud of that.
 
andrushkiwt said:
I couldn't get into that one, cause it seemed that GTA just did a much better job with it during that time period. I admit I do play a lot of CoD when not busy. Almost master prestige :) I'm not sure if I should be proud of that.
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It's good to be behind the curve-Saints i got for like 5 bucks from Steam a few months ago. CoD is fun to watch, but i can't play. I've been playing League of Legends since beta test, if i had all the time back....naaah, i've been a dedicated gamer since space invaders, loved every advance and can't wait to see whats next.

Also, this same guy posted a song a while back and i thought of you when i heard it, if he could get his mixes and vocals sounding the way yours do-he'd have some great songs i think.
 
Stratomaster said:
It's good to be behind the curve-Saints i got for like 5 bucks from Steam a few months ago. CoD is fun to watch, but i can't play. I've been playing League of Legends since beta test, if i had all the time back....naaah, i've been a dedicated gamer since space invaders, loved every advance and can't wait to see whats next.

Also, this same guy posted a song a while back and i thought of you when i heard it, if he could get his mixes and vocals sounding the way yours do-he'd have some great songs i think.
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I should, and will, I think, start a gaming thread. I wonder if anyone else plays whatever on here. And I totally get that. His music hits home for me - just needs a little cleanup and attention in some spots. Not that I'm the person to do it, but I can try. I think I know what's missing, and, really, it's mostly there. Great songs and compositions, just some vocal work. Maybe he'll let me help and see if I cna't get it on the right track. Worth a try.
 
Nola said:
It's the 2nd time I saw him do it and the other time he did mention it without provocation, which is why I said something yesterday. He did it here: Original pop punk song (need mix feedback)


I'm not trying to be a jerk, but I just happened to notice it again in this thread, and for his own growth as a musician felt I should tell him. I get being proud and all that and agreed he is doing a good job so far. Anyway! No hard feelings, BT.
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Honestly, I wasn't trying to be like "hey look at how cool I am, I did this and that!". It's more like, say I'm asking for feedback on a buffet, and I point out the specific meals that I helped create, so people know what I have control over. But I do take pride in what I do. It usually takes me a year to finish a song, and I work on it almost every day.
 
Big Thier said:
Honestly, I wasn't trying to be like "hey look at how cool I am, I did this and that!". It's more like, say I'm asking for feedback on a buffet, and I point out the specific meals that I helped create, so people know what I have control over. But I do take pride in what I do. It usually takes me a year to finish a song, and I work on it almost every day.
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Gotcha!
No big deal I think I just read it wrong.
 
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