Struggling with Capturing Electric Guitar Tone/Sustain

D-Minor

New member
I've read over and over again how to record electric guitar, yet I continue to struggle with capturing the sound I am hearing in the room. When I record a track and listen back, it's just missing something tone-wise and more importantly, the sustain just isn't there. I've tried several amps with an SM57 in front in a number of positions on the speaker. I've tried using a condenser a couple feet in front and mixing them together. But it just all feels dead to me.

Figure I might as well put out another call for suggestions to see if anyone was similarly struggling while seemingly doing what the majority of tutorials would say to do, and if you found something that finally worked.

Thanks.
 
Hi!

A mic on a cab is never going to sound the same, to you, as a cab in a room for two main reasons.
1: You feel it when it's live, assuming the amp is loud and 2: the mic is generally much closer to the drive than anyone's ears will or should be.

What sort of amp have you got? With combos people will often get them up off the floor or, at least, angle them upwards to get a slightly better idea of how the thing really sounds.

The difference between judging a take and judging a take in context can be pretty huge. Have you got a mix going on?

When you say "dead to me", do you mean dead in terms of ambience/reverberation?
You might try the two mic thing again but with the condenser much further back so the two mics are very much close and ambient?

Anyway...Do you have a clip or two to post? In and out of context would be super helpful. :)
Tell us a bit about the gear you're using and the environment you're in too.

Welcome to HR!
 
Thanks for the reply. The amps I've been recording with are a Vox AC30, Marshall DSL40 and a Fender Hot Rod Deluxe. When I say dead, the issue I've had is really about sustain. I feel like the notes just die off. And forget coming up with a cool dirty tone with some reverb, it just comes through as mud. Admittedly, I haven't tried angling the amp up to get a better idea of the sound so maybe I should give that a try. I figure it has to be something small like that. I've basically resolved to doing a ton of work in post, and I really want to stop relying so heavily on adding comp/eq/effects to get a usable sound.

Sorry, I am not on my recording computer right now, but will try to post something tomorrow.
 
That's cool.

Might sound like a stupid question but is the sustain there in the room?
You can play with compression to make changes where sustain is concerned but, of course, it's nicer to be able to just get the sound you want.

Will come back for clips. :)
 
Post a link. Lets hear it. As Steen said, what sounds good in the room may not sound good at mic. Base your tone adjustment on the sound coming through your monitors. Also have to ask: how loud are you tracking? Those three amps can deliver great tone but all are brutally loud.
 
I'll throw in another thing to play with--when using the SM57 up close to the guitar cabinet, have a play with the mic positioning and aiming. Moving the mic from the centre of the speaker to the edge (with stops in the middle) can significantly change what sound you're getting. Similarly, a mic pointing straight at the speaker will sound different from one at a 45 degree angle pointing at the speaker.

Finally, if you have a condenser (I use SDCs but I've seen LDCs used as well) that can handle the levels, give that a try for more brightness and detail.

To end, I endorse those who've said the recording will never exactly match what you hear live--but you just have to find the recorded sound you like best.
 
Thanks for the reply. The amps I've been recording with are a Vox AC30, Marshall DSL40 and a Fender Hot Rod Deluxe. When I say dead, the issue I've had is really about sustain. ...
Jeepers, those are some biggish amps for home recording in a room. I'd be deaf[er] trying to get those to a sweet spot in my little room. (If I thought I was hearing sustain that wasn't showing up in the track, it would probably be the ringing in my ears the mic wasn't picking up!)

If the mic isn't recording sustain, it's most likely because it's simply not there. You can play with placement and swap mics all you want, but what is being recorded is truer to what's coming from the amp than what your brain has manufactured.

"Natural" sustain is usually a combination of the amp's characteristics when it starts to get to that point where the amplifier stages are getting pushed pretty hard, coupled with some reverb (both amp and room). It's pretty hard to do, honestly, in a home recording situation (IMO/IME) without an amp that has a very usable power level control, or by simply using a small amp that you can drive to the limit. If you have to record 30w+ tube(ish) amps, you're going to need some FX, or earplugs.
 
"Natural" sustain is usually a combination of the amp's characteristics when it starts to get to that point where the amplifier stages are getting pushed pretty hard, coupled with some reverb (both amp and room).

I was thinking it was reverb you were hearing, not technically sustain (compression and/or string vibration assisting in the notes trailing off).

As Steen also suggested, trying to use some compression to help 'pull up' the end of the notes, if done properly, won't alter the sound/character of the guitar recorded but will buy you that beefier presence it sounds like you want. Adding compression (and reverb) in post production is super easy, and it's just a matter of getting it to where your ears want it and where you're hearing it while tracking live. VST based compressors can be relatively transparent when using them in moderation.

Otherwise you have to add a room mic to capture the full atmosphere of the space.
 
I'm thinking it's partly just your ear/brain compressing the whole thing when it's pounding in the room. ;)

Getting the amps off the floor, or even angled back, has the added advantage of reducing the fast reflections off the floor and will make a difference all by itself. Don't put it right up at the ceiling. ;) I try not to put it in the exact center of any dimension of the room either.

I will say that I know what you mean, though. Like I don't think it's uncommon at all. Especially with anything remotely clean. When we're playing and it's loud, it feels like it's all full and ringing. Listen back, and it's like "...ok...???" I'd be willing to bet that if you actually played it back as loud as it was in the tracking room, you'd feel a bit differently. This is actually pretty close to what you sound like, though.

A lot of times when we talk about sustain, we are talking about the guitar and the person playing it. I don't know you (or your guitar) from nowhere, but it's something to look at.

But then go to YouTube and see if you can pull up individual guitars tracks of songs that you know maybe with the kind of tone your looking for or gear you own. Some of those things are just sad all by themselves.
 
Adding a compressor pedal early in the chain might help.

Playing at such high volume that the guitar is practically feeding back all the time is another way to add sustain. You don't play the guitar so much as unmute it when you want sound.
 
You didnt day, but for a typical at home room those amps are a bit much. I'd try to borrow a 15W amp, tube, so you can push the output tubes into a sweeter spot.
 
Got to agree with all who mentioned smaller amps and reverb. Often what we might call sustain is actually the reflections you hear in the room that aren't at enough volume to be recorded by the (I assume) close mic on the amp speaker grille. I record loud cabs and combos with close/far mic pairs to get a particular sound. That being said-for actual crushing(amp compression) type sustain I go with practice amps dimed or nearly, on low cost amp stands. I use cheap Chinese things like fender frontman 25 and acoustic lead g20, using different mics (dynamic, condenser, ribbon) and tweaking amp settings to get what I am going for. But to answer OP I would try adding a room mic or pulling the mic back and recording and see if that doesn't help get the sound you hear "in the room" onto your track.
 
There is no reason you can't use a larger amp, but I highly recommend getting it out of the room you are tracking in. Invest in some longer mic and instrument cables and put a buffered tuner in line to reduce signal loss into the amp. You will be amazed how much easier it is to dial in a tone when you can hear it through your monitors exactly as it is being tracked.
 
I track with big amps also-I just do it from another room. Still it's fun to stick a small to medium amp in a weird space like a stairway(big sound!) a hall or whatever, amd mic the amp and 6-8 feet away and combine as desired.
 
Back
Top