Muddy Sound >_> Studio One and Cubase

N

npalmer96

New member
Hi guys. So before I even get started, I am the vocalist of the metal band. We're drop-tuned to A. Chugging, breakdowns, the whole deal. Lots of bass and drive in our amp settings. This is obviously going to be a bigger problem to record than standard rock or pop. We are not looking for mastered, professional radio-worthy sound though. We just want raw clarity (which I have seen without having to mess with the tracks numerous times), but we are getting muddy recordings with Studio One and Cubase. {Basically, we want clear demos. I know people that are good at EQing and mixing/mastering tracks which I will get assistance from later.}

I have been told by numerous people that Studio One is not a software to record heavy guitars with. We are using 13-gauge strings. In a recording session a while ago, we used the MXL 990 microphone to record with Cubase (and also direct audio) and they both sounded muddy. We hadn't tampered with the settings on the amp for a clearer recording. Yesterday we went at it again in Studio One (after lowering the drive) and we got far less muddy recordings, but still muddy. That was with direct audio. We then went and bought a Shure SM57 recording microphone and it didn't really sound any better. These are like 3 star recordings. A lot better than what we getting last time, but still not THAT good. We are using an Ibanez RGA guitar with standard Ibanez pickups. Line VI amp. Any suggestions? Thanks
 
npalmer96 said:
We are not looking for mastered, professional radio-worthy sound
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That's what they all say. :)

I know people that are good at EQing and mixing/mastering tracks which I will get assistance from later.
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Nothing wrong with that, but you shouldn't be depending on that. You should be trying to get as close to finished in your sound before even touching the RECORD button.

I have been told by numerous people that Studio One is not a software to record heavy guitars with.
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I don't know Studio One, but I'll bet my last dollar that this is completely false. There is no difference in sound quality from one DAW to the next, be it CUBASE, STUDIO ONE, REAPER, etc....
We hadn't tampered with the settings on the amp for a clearer recording.
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That doesn't make any sense. Why would you not do that? Like I said above, you should be trying to get your sound as close to what you want the final product to be before you hit RECORD. Don't depend on "fixing it in the mix" because it won't work.
We then went and bought a Shure SM57 recording microphone and it didn't really sound any better.
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SM57's are used on probably about 97% of guitar recordings that you, me and everyone else has been listening to for years.
 
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Assuming your Line 6 amp is a combo, get it off the ground. Put it on a chair or something. An upholstered ottoman works great.

A 57 on center is brightest, getting less bright as you move the mic toward the edge of the driver.

Lowering the drive is often a good thing. What sounds right from the amp tends to be too much on a recording.
 
What you hear and what the mic hears are two different things. Change your amp settings to get it to sound good for the mic. Mic placement is important so experiment where to place the mic on the amps. Mud is usually associated with 250hz - 400hz range; +/- some. Try dialing back in that region. Be sure to place the mic right up against the grill to remove the room from the recording. If you've got distance between the amp and the mic, then the room comes into play and it could add mud.

I'll reiterate what Rami said in a different: Never take advice from someone who tells you: "that Studio One is not a software to record heavy guitars with." What of crock of shit!!
 
No guys, he's right. Studio One is well known to be terrible at recording heavy guitars, nyckelharpa, kalimba, bagpipes, kazoo and mandolin. It excels, however, at recording banjo.

A guy at Banjo Center told me this.

Cheers :P
 
Aw man.. npalmer, I won't even make a joke here. You and your friends/band/whatever have a serious amount of time to spend in learning everything you are thinking you have a clue of yet.

It may take years to be able to find the perfect mic setup for just a vocal. I understand that you feel that everything will be good all at once, because you have the drive. But you will be taken back when you realize that your band may sound like shit no matter what DAW you use, and whatever cheap mics you throw at it.

Trust me man, I have been there. I am not judging you or your band.

Though, I will bet $2g that your first recording is going to sound like total ass, because you are listening to stupidity of others that do not have a clue. You have stated the fact that you listened to idiots already.

Use your ears and figure out for yourself what is good.

And keep in mind, 13 gauge strings I assume are used because of the fact you tune down low? Guess what makes your recordings muddy? Not the DAW, it likely shitty guitars and pickups that are not setup to play with such strings.

I'm just guessing, but I stand behind the fact that you do not have a clue as to where you are going yet.
 
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why drop A in the first place?

don't you know that your harmonics start suffering below D?

If it don't have the sound coming out of the amp, its not going to get captured. Also cranking the amp in a non treated room is mud city.

and if its not sounding good though a 57, you're definately doing something wrong.
 
.......too soon to get another infraction, so....never mind.
 
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The reason your recordings sound muddy is not the software, mics, brand of guitars, etc. It's because with the dropped tuning guitars and "heavy" amp settings you mentioned, the guitars and bass are all competing in exactly the same low-mid frequency range (where the kick drum also lives.) And when someone can't hear himself clearly, what does he do? Turns up, of course! This just adds more decibels in the same frequency range and makes the situation worse.

The way to get clearer recordings is to use EQ to spread out the instruments so that they are complementing each other by playing around each other in the frequency spectrum, not fighting it out in mudville. Most DAW's have a frequency analyzer plugin you can use to see where each instrument is sitting in the spectrum. Once you've got an idea of the ranges where the instruments are overlapping, use some gentle cutting to carve out space for each instrument. This should add clarity to your mixes, but also make them sound "bigger" because you will be covering more of the frequency spectrum, instead of bunching everything up into one small bandwidth.

Hope this helps.
 
Your understanding that the choice of DAW is the reason for the poor quality is completley incorrect. I have heard great mixes on almost every DAW in the book. (almost) You could create a great recording in audacity with the propper approach. Keep in mind "shit in shit out" Find the right guitar tone etc before you ever press record. That includes the onboard EQ on your amplifier. Then finding that sweetspot when you mic your cabinet. It can be quite a painstaking task. Don't blame the gear or the software. You actually have a pretty decent set of tools currently at your disposal to record with. Drop the blame game and do some research on the interwebs. Research your gear and how to propperly use it. Research recording techniques and methods (preferably relating to your musical genre of choice)

You would be quite supprised just how much you will learn from a few internet searches. There is no overnight approach to recording a "decent quality" song. It is all trial and error.
Best of luck.

My overall suggestion.....DO YOUR RESEARCH!! Spend the time researching and it will pay off!
 
How about a list of equipment/mics you're using to give a better idea of what we're staring into.
Start by hitting Premier Guitar and picking a few Rig Rundown vids from bands you want to sound like. Get some ideas. Put foam under your bridge to muffle the goose honk. Invest in a couple of LDCs to set in the room and record your live sound.
An $800 investment in a pair of Baby Bottles (those are midrange Blue mikes BTW) hung where your ears tell you the sound is good can yield you a decent stereo sound. If you truly just want clear demos, that would be plenty. Just make sure your live mix is where you want it AT the microphones. If on the other hand, you're interested in tracking, you're going to need a mike locker and a lot of time/advice/experimentation/acoustic treatment/serious investment...
 
Th OP has one post and hasn't been back. It's been a week. Just trying to save everyone their energy. :)
 
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