How should I record a classical singer with piano?

garytube

New member
I usually record rock music, so I was just wondering how I should go about recording a female classical/opera singer that will be accompanied by a piano. Here is what I know: It will be at a college in a medium sized room (second floor of the library). I've never seen the room, so I'm guessing it will have a lower amount of reflections? I don't know if there will be a riser/stage or not. As for the piano, I haven't a clue if its upright or baby grand, but my guess will be upright. They won't have any amplification(P.A.), just natural acoustic volume.
Here is my gear that I have: 2 Shure SM81's, 1 Gefell UMT70s, 2 RadioShack PZM's, Mackie mixer, and a Harmon Kardon 2 track cassette deck. I plan to dump this into my computer for mixdown.
So, its a given that I have 2 tracks to work with. So should I:
1. Close/ area mic with Gefell for vocalist, and SM 81 on Piano for control on mixdown, adding a touch of artificial reverb?
2. Should I space 2 PZM's on the floor/stage for stereo spread?
3. Should I x/y SM81's?
4. M/S with Gefell figure 8, and SM81 for M?

Where should I place the mic's for choices 1-4 in relation to the performers?
I'm not sure if I can put a mic stand in the middle if the stage(or the audience). Can I do any of these techniques from the side of the stage, as to not be too intrusive? I wish my PZM's were the better Crown 30 ones..... :confused:
 
It really depends on the piano, and the sound you want to go for, and the piano. A baby grand is easy, an upright not so much.

For a baby grand, then two 81's inside, on on the lows, one on the highs, and the gefell for the vox.

Or you could bottom-mic it with the PZMs.

With an upright, you could try putting the PZMs on the back and using the 81s for an area record.

I doubt the M/S approach would work, mostly because of the setup of most piano/vocalist stages. Use the Gefell on the vocalist and save the 81s/PZMs for the piano
 
An audience eh? The singer might not want a mic in front of them during a show. I would rely on the 81s in near-coincident pair rather than XY, wherever you can place them unobtrusively in the audience, ideally in the first few rows, but in the back if you have to. Then put a Crown on the lid of the piano, and the Gefell on the singer if you can get away with that. Maybe you can hang a mic from above. Rely on the stereo pair for your main mix, and just add in the spot mics as necessary.

You say you're going to dump to your computer for mixdown, but really you have to record a stereo mix on your tape deck. Using one track for piano and one track for vocals, and creating a processed stereo sound will probably not be acceptable for a classical CD.
 
Thanks for the responses. I don't think this will be a super serious recording, but just wanted to get it to sound as good as I can. The performer wants it for herself for a critique on her singing.
As far as putting a PZM on the lid, how should I do that? I don't think I want to use duct tape (although it would hold it real good!).
Thanks again!
 
If this is a recital performance, use a pair of room mics setup somewhere they would appear natural. As a diverse performer myself (classically trained, yet sometimes a rock musician), I can tell you that it would be awful distracting, improper and outright rude to have a whole bunch of gear and cables around while performing a classical set.

However, if this is a private recording, it's completely different. The room you describe does not sound large, but here's what I would do.

Keep the vocal mic several feet from the singer. The object here is to allow the voice to use the room. If the mic is too close to the singer, you will pick up too many overtones and the voice will sound unnatural, and possibly distort the mic. (Dynamics in classical music are unlike you've ever recorded before!)

The piano need not be close mic'ed either. You could always close mic and then have room mics. Room mics would be very important for this kind of recording. Use them!

What you should be going for is to get the recording to sound as natural as possible, as if you could close your eyes and hear someone performing on a stage.
 
It is indeed a recital performance with an audience. I wish my PZMS were of better quality, then I might be inclined to just do a spaced pair on each side of the stage, so as not to be intrusive with mics, stands, etc...
 
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