Dealing with stubborn musicians

[Mr Clean]

Been there, done that and left the band. It's a nightmare and like others have said, you can't change them. .

[grimtraveller]

The problem is that you are not dealing with professionals. Professionals work to make the song and the recording great, no matter what. This ego stupidity doesn't happen.

Just last month I watched a documentary on Big brother and the holding company. In relation to Janis Joplin, they'd disagree with you straightaway. As would John Lennon, who felt that Paul McCartney would try to "subconsciously sabotage" his great songs. And I think Keith Richards would too, when the subject of Brian Jones comes up. As would members of the original Mahavishnu Orchestra, Tony Iommi on Ozzy, Dee Dee Ramone on Tommy, Ian Paice and Jon Lord on Glenn Hughes and Tommy Bolin, Ginger Baker on Jack Bruce, Gene Simmons on Ace Frehley, Francis Rossi on John Coghlan and Alan Lancaster, Rick Wright on Roger Waters, Jeff Beck on Keith Relf, Stevie Nicks on Lindsey Buckingham, Gene Clark on David Crosby, Steve Took on Marc Bolan, Brian Robertson on Phil Lynott, Brian Downey on Brian Robertson, Andy Summers and Stewart Copeland on Sting, Sam on Dave, Noel Gallagher on Liam, Dave Davies on Ray, Brian McLean on Arthur Lee, Jean Jacques Burnel on Hugh Cornwell, Les McKeown on Eric Faulkner, Joe Zawinul and Wayne Shorter on Jaco Pastorious, Dennis DeYoung on Tommy Shaw, Mary Wilson on Diana Ross................I could fill 7 pages or more on the professionals for whom this ego stupidity most certainly did happen and those that got in the way of great songs happening. It's part of the constituent of popular music.....and human nature.

[witzendoz]

The Who, Rodger Daltrey and Pete Townsend, would just punch each other out, then go on to make great songs. Funny they are the only 2 left.

Alan.

[grimtraveller]

The Who, Rodger Daltrey and Pete Townsend, would just punch each other out, then go on to make great songs. Funny they are the only 2 left.

I just read Townhend's autobiography and while there certainly were fisticuffs a couple of times between those two, I was surprized that it was so rare. The way things have been written up over the years, you'd think all the Who ever did, and Townshend and Daltrey in particular, was fight. I was also really quite taken by Townshend's feelings of affection towards Daltrey and his assertion that in his estimation, Daltrey was always the leader of the band. Nothing like getting it from the horses mouth.


That last sentence wasn't meant to come out like that !

[SteveAlton]

"You're not the drummer........

how do you guys deal with this?

Drum Machine.....It never talks back and NEVER loses time, is never high, and never late

For all my final recordings as the writer I always use "Session Players"

[grimtraveller]

Drum Machine.....It never talks back and NEVER loses time, is never high, and never late

And has absolutely no independent thought, can't improvise, can't vary timing, twist, feel or be a rhythmic woman.....

[Lt. Bob]

Drum Machine.....It never talks back and NEVER loses time, is never high, and never late

"

it does however provide that sterile robotic feel with no groove whatsoever.

[SteveAlton]

I get that........So my home demo has the drum machine thing going on...

When it comes to final version......real drummer all day long

[Lt. Bob]

I get that........So my home demo has the drum machine thing going on...

When it comes to final version......real drummer all day long

gotcha and I do the same thing however .... not having a rhythm that grooves impacts your playing in that the tracks the real drumber will have to play with also have no groove.

It's an unavoidable consequence of having to work that way.
I struggle with that aspect pretty much constantly.

[Farview]

gotcha and I do the same thing however .... not having a rhythm that grooves impacts your playing in that the tracks the real drumber will have to play with also have no groove.

It's an unavoidable consequence of having to work that way.
I struggle with that aspect pretty much constantly.

Why don't you just record scratch tracks to the drum machine record the real drummer, then play the real tracks to the drummer? You can have the drummer play to a click and scratch tracks, so you aren't distracted by having to play and record him at the same time.