I am very worried about the prospect of recording a drum set. It seems like the drum sound I'm looking for is hard to come by in the ROCK STYLE. Because of this I am really stalling on buying the mics I need.
I decided to start critically listening to the drum sounds on some rock albums I own hoping that this would shed some light...
I listened to some old stuff first like: Skid Row's self titled album, Faith No More: Angel dust, Van Halen: OU812. How do people make drums sound so bad? I'm sure it's the sound they were going for, but often the bass drum sounds like a higher note than the floor tom! Everything sounds pinched and over produced. I think the epitomy of bad drum sounds here was Extreme: III (yes I am embarrased I ever used to listen to some of these albums).
Why did they do that and how, so I can do the opposite?
I thought maybe it was just cause it was the 80's and noone knew any better and I had a bad taste in music then... So I listened to Dream Theater: Awake... Still that bad "death metal" bass drum sound. And I don't think snares sounded like that.
Then I listened to Rush:Signals. It was a big improvement, but it seemed like they tried to make the bass drum sound like it was 80 feet wide. and the hi-hat has this very colored sound to it.
Next was Smashing Pumpkins: Gish. There was this strange clicking sound on the bass and all the toms. I remember hearing that the bass drum was recorded with one mic inside and one through a large funnel. I don't know if that did much for the sound. Then I listened to Pumpkins: Mellon Collie. Again! That death metal bass drum sound and a weak sounding snare! If anyone has this CD, listen to JellyBelly and notice how much better a snare with attack would sound.
Then I listenend to Dave Matthews Band: Before these Crowded Streets. This is the only thing that came close to how drums should sound! The snare had good attack. The bass drum was consistent and you could actually hear that it was a bass drum!
I know most of the reason that these reviews are so bad is the CD's I chose to analyze. But seriously, even Takin' it to the Streets by the Dooby Brother's has this cardboard bass drum sound!
I started thinking of reasons for this and found a few things which really confuse me. It seems that on vocals and acoustic instruments the convention (though often departed from) is to use a pretty accurate condenser mic with a little bit of personality and coloration. Aren't drums acoustic instruments? Why are so many people miking rock bass drums with a Beta 52, when this mike significantly scoops out the lows and gives a 12 DB peak between 2 and 5 K!? Everyone seems to like miking the snare with an SM57. If it's a rock song, shouldn't the snare have as much snap as possible, and wouldn't this be much better achieved with a small diaphragm condenser mic? I've heard some really stellar drum sounds from a few well-produced jazz CD's. Why don't people use these sounds for rock? It's not like the rock drums sound more forceful or anything, they just sound more peaky and dull. How did producer's create those bad 80's drum sounds?
All right, I'll stop... I know I've dropped too much in people's laps here, but if anyone has any advice or thoughts on the things I've said above, I would much appreciate it!
-Matt
I decided to start critically listening to the drum sounds on some rock albums I own hoping that this would shed some light...
I listened to some old stuff first like: Skid Row's self titled album, Faith No More: Angel dust, Van Halen: OU812. How do people make drums sound so bad? I'm sure it's the sound they were going for, but often the bass drum sounds like a higher note than the floor tom! Everything sounds pinched and over produced. I think the epitomy of bad drum sounds here was Extreme: III (yes I am embarrased I ever used to listen to some of these albums).
Why did they do that and how, so I can do the opposite?
I thought maybe it was just cause it was the 80's and noone knew any better and I had a bad taste in music then... So I listened to Dream Theater: Awake... Still that bad "death metal" bass drum sound. And I don't think snares sounded like that.
Then I listened to Rush:Signals. It was a big improvement, but it seemed like they tried to make the bass drum sound like it was 80 feet wide. and the hi-hat has this very colored sound to it.
Next was Smashing Pumpkins: Gish. There was this strange clicking sound on the bass and all the toms. I remember hearing that the bass drum was recorded with one mic inside and one through a large funnel. I don't know if that did much for the sound. Then I listened to Pumpkins: Mellon Collie. Again! That death metal bass drum sound and a weak sounding snare! If anyone has this CD, listen to JellyBelly and notice how much better a snare with attack would sound.
Then I listenend to Dave Matthews Band: Before these Crowded Streets. This is the only thing that came close to how drums should sound! The snare had good attack. The bass drum was consistent and you could actually hear that it was a bass drum!
I know most of the reason that these reviews are so bad is the CD's I chose to analyze. But seriously, even Takin' it to the Streets by the Dooby Brother's has this cardboard bass drum sound!
I started thinking of reasons for this and found a few things which really confuse me. It seems that on vocals and acoustic instruments the convention (though often departed from) is to use a pretty accurate condenser mic with a little bit of personality and coloration. Aren't drums acoustic instruments? Why are so many people miking rock bass drums with a Beta 52, when this mike significantly scoops out the lows and gives a 12 DB peak between 2 and 5 K!? Everyone seems to like miking the snare with an SM57. If it's a rock song, shouldn't the snare have as much snap as possible, and wouldn't this be much better achieved with a small diaphragm condenser mic? I've heard some really stellar drum sounds from a few well-produced jazz CD's. Why don't people use these sounds for rock? It's not like the rock drums sound more forceful or anything, they just sound more peaky and dull. How did producer's create those bad 80's drum sounds?
All right, I'll stop... I know I've dropped too much in people's laps here, but if anyone has any advice or thoughts on the things I've said above, I would much appreciate it!
-Matt