acceptable noise level when recording
- Thread starter crosstudio
- Start date
crosstudio
New member
krisitan said:
yea, i noticed that when i moved to 24 bit, its pretty damn hard to make something clip. You have to b doing something REALLY crazy to get it to.
then i said:
and for that reason i've taken my analog compressor out of my recording chain. now i go directly from mic --> mic-pre --> d/a/d box. since i'm not clipping, i only compress (if necessary) during mixing.
yea, i noticed that when i moved to 24 bit, its pretty damn hard to make something clip. You have to b doing something REALLY crazy to get it to.
then i said:
and for that reason i've taken my analog compressor out of my recording chain. now i go directly from mic --> mic-pre --> d/a/d box. since i'm not clipping, i only compress (if necessary) during mixing.
I cannot get any better than -58db to -64db. (the meter is fluctuating)
Question : What are you guys looking at to get the noise floor measurement?
I am opening up Cakewalk Sonar, arming a track for recording and setting the db range on the record meter for 90db.
I run all instruments through a Mackie 1604 vlzpro into a vs880-VX (older model) then into my 16bit Turtle Beach Montego II sound card (cheese, I know) via RCA cable to 1/8" line input. The output of the soundcard is then sent back to the mixer. The outs of the mixer are sent to my power amp. All of the sliders are pinned on the mackie and the vs880.
This setup yields a noise floor of : -58db to -64db
****************************************************
PART II: Wait.......If I double click the speaker icon in the task bar in the sytem tray go to properties ---> recording controls. Now adjust the line in slider as low as it can go but still pick up a signal.
VOILA!!!! -74db with the the mixer pinned!!!! (every instruments slider turned up to 11) -- as well as the vs880 out on 10 !!!!!!!
Please give some feedback:
1.) Is it bad to keep the line input on the computer at the lowest setting possible?
2.) How much of a difference would a 24bit sound card make? (echo gina, layla...etc)
3.) Is it bad to drink 5 cups of coffee after 9:30 est??????
Thanks
Question : What are you guys looking at to get the noise floor measurement?
I am opening up Cakewalk Sonar, arming a track for recording and setting the db range on the record meter for 90db.
I run all instruments through a Mackie 1604 vlzpro into a vs880-VX (older model) then into my 16bit Turtle Beach Montego II sound card (cheese, I know) via RCA cable to 1/8" line input. The output of the soundcard is then sent back to the mixer. The outs of the mixer are sent to my power amp. All of the sliders are pinned on the mackie and the vs880.
This setup yields a noise floor of : -58db to -64db
****************************************************
PART II: Wait.......If I double click the speaker icon in the task bar in the sytem tray go to properties ---> recording controls. Now adjust the line in slider as low as it can go but still pick up a signal.
VOILA!!!! -74db with the the mixer pinned!!!! (every instruments slider turned up to 11) -- as well as the vs880 out on 10 !!!!!!!
Please give some feedback:
1.) Is it bad to keep the line input on the computer at the lowest setting possible?
2.) How much of a difference would a 24bit sound card make? (echo gina, layla...etc)
3.) Is it bad to drink 5 cups of coffee after 9:30 est??????
Thanks
I cannot get any better than -58db to -64db. (the meter is fluctuating)
Question : What are you guys looking at to get the noise floor measurement?
I am opening up Cakewalk Sonar, arming a track for recording and setting the db range on the record meter for 90db.
I run all instruments through a Mackie 1604 vlzpro into a vs880-VX (older model) then into my 16bit Turtle Beach Montego II sound card (cheese, I know) via RCA cable to 1/8" line input. The output of the soundcard is then sent back to the mixer. The outs of the mixer are sent to my power amp. All of the sliders are pinned on the mackie and the vs880.
This setup yields a noise floor of : -58db to -64db
****************************************************
PART II: Wait.......If I double click the speaker icon in the task bar in the sytem tray go to properties ---> recording controls. Now adjust the line in slider as low as it can go but still pick up a signal.
VOILA!!!! -74db with the the mixer pinned!!!! (every instruments slider turned up to 11) -- as well as the vs880 out on 10 !!!!!!!
Please give some feedback:
1.) Is it bad to keep the line input on the computer at the lowest setting possible?
2.) How much of a difference would a 24bit sound card make? (echo gina, layla...etc)
3.) How much of a difference would it make if i sent the signal from the vs880 coaxial digital out to the coaxial digital in on my computer?
4.) Is it bad to drink 5 cups of coffee after 9:30 est??????
Thanks
Question : What are you guys looking at to get the noise floor measurement?
I am opening up Cakewalk Sonar, arming a track for recording and setting the db range on the record meter for 90db.
I run all instruments through a Mackie 1604 vlzpro into a vs880-VX (older model) then into my 16bit Turtle Beach Montego II sound card (cheese, I know) via RCA cable to 1/8" line input. The output of the soundcard is then sent back to the mixer. The outs of the mixer are sent to my power amp. All of the sliders are pinned on the mackie and the vs880.
This setup yields a noise floor of : -58db to -64db
****************************************************
PART II: Wait.......If I double click the speaker icon in the task bar in the sytem tray go to properties ---> recording controls. Now adjust the line in slider as low as it can go but still pick up a signal.
VOILA!!!! -74db with the the mixer pinned!!!! (every instruments slider turned up to 11) -- as well as the vs880 out on 10 !!!!!!!
Please give some feedback:
1.) Is it bad to keep the line input on the computer at the lowest setting possible?
2.) How much of a difference would a 24bit sound card make? (echo gina, layla...etc)
3.) How much of a difference would it make if i sent the signal from the vs880 coaxial digital out to the coaxial digital in on my computer?
4.) Is it bad to drink 5 cups of coffee after 9:30 est??????
Thanks
Blue Bear Sound
New member
1) It depends - does the signal sound better that way? If you have to push the pre too hard to get a decent level into the computer, it's going to be a problem...Gargamel said:
2) Not much, relative to the difference a better mic and preamp combination will give you. (Unless you're already using a Neumann U87, Avalon pre and Lucid A/D converter!
)3) Depends which A/D converter is better - if the soundcard's converter is better, then there is no advantage, if the 880 converter is better, then you're better off......
4) Not if you're nocturnal!
Cheers!
Bruce
drstawl
Banned
No point in turning down your inputs like that. Most input circuits like the range of input signal to be between 85% and 95% of the possible range. Sure- it gets quieter as measured by your "noise floor" but that's not the "working" noise floor.
My guess is the problem is the crappy connect provided by that 1/8" miniplug connection.
It ain't just the 24 bits. It's a better physical connection and better circuitry overall (converters in particular) that matter.
24 bits won't hurt you though, except in BandWidth....
My guess is the problem is the crappy connect provided by that 1/8" miniplug connection.
It ain't just the 24 bits. It's a better physical connection and better circuitry overall (converters in particular) that matter.
24 bits won't hurt you though, except in BandWidth....
Gargamel:
3.) How much of a difference would it make if i sent the signal from the vs880 coaxial digital out to the coaxial digital in on my computer?
Bruce:
3) Depends which A/D converter is better - if the soundcard's converter is better, then there is no advantage, if the 880 converter is better, then you're better off......
Thanks Bruce...one more question. The signal is going from the vs880 to the computer no matter what. However i have 2 choices: Coaxial out (880) to Coaxial in (sound card)
or
rca out (880) to 1/8" in (soundcard)
Will their be a big difference?
1) It depends - does the signal sound better that way? If you have to push the pre too hard to get a decent level into the computer, it's going to be a problem...
-- the hottest signal I can get with this setting is -24db. To low?
***************************************************
thank You
drstawl:
"No point in turning down your inputs like that. Most input circuits like the range of input signal to be between 85% and 95% of the possible range. Sure- it gets quieter as measured by your "noise floor" but that's not the "working" noise floor."
Can you elaborate?
3.) How much of a difference would it make if i sent the signal from the vs880 coaxial digital out to the coaxial digital in on my computer?
Bruce:
3) Depends which A/D converter is better - if the soundcard's converter is better, then there is no advantage, if the 880 converter is better, then you're better off......
Thanks Bruce...one more question. The signal is going from the vs880 to the computer no matter what. However i have 2 choices: Coaxial out (880) to Coaxial in (sound card)
or
rca out (880) to 1/8" in (soundcard)
Will their be a big difference?
1) It depends - does the signal sound better that way? If you have to push the pre too hard to get a decent level into the computer, it's going to be a problem...
-- the hottest signal I can get with this setting is -24db. To low?
***************************************************
thank You
drstawl:
"No point in turning down your inputs like that. Most input circuits like the range of input signal to be between 85% and 95% of the possible range. Sure- it gets quieter as measured by your "noise floor" but that's not the "working" noise floor."
Can you elaborate?
drstawl
Banned
> 1.) Is it bad to keep the line input on the computer at the lowest setting possible?
Yes, it is. If the signal level is too high at this input you'd be better off turning down the output level of the previous stage.
Better in terms of overall S/N ratio.
But my favorite transfers are digital.
Yes, it is. If the signal level is too high at this input you'd be better off turning down the output level of the previous stage.
Better in terms of overall S/N ratio.
But my favorite transfers are digital.
Blue Bear Sound
New member
OK, I'll try again...
You have 2 choices.... the 880 takes the analog signal --> internal A/D --> digital out to the soundcard
OR
880 analog signal --> 880 analog output --> soundcard analog input --> soundcard A/D converter
1) If the 880 converter is the better A/D, then it makes sense to let it convert your analog signal to digital, and then simply transfer it to the soundcard digitally.
2) If you're soundcard has the better A/D converters, you would be better sending the 880's analog output to the soundcard and letting the soundcard do the A/D conversion.
Bruce
You have 2 choices.... the 880 takes the analog signal --> internal A/D --> digital out to the soundcard
OR
880 analog signal --> 880 analog output --> soundcard analog input --> soundcard A/D converter
1) If the 880 converter is the better A/D, then it makes sense to let it convert your analog signal to digital, and then simply transfer it to the soundcard digitally.
2) If you're soundcard has the better A/D converters, you would be better sending the 880's analog output to the soundcard and letting the soundcard do the A/D conversion.
Bruce
Thanks
drstawl:
> 1.) Is it bad to keep the line input on the computer at the lowest setting possible?
Yes, it is. If the signal level is too high at this input you'd be better off turning down the output level of the previous stage.
Better in terms of overall S/N ratio.
---by doing this my noise floor goes from -74db to -68
drstawl:
> 1.) Is it bad to keep the line input on the computer at the lowest setting possible?
Yes, it is. If the signal level is too high at this input you'd be better off turning down the output level of the previous stage.
Better in terms of overall S/N ratio.
---by doing this my noise floor goes from -74db to -68
Michael Jones
New member
How do you go about measuring this?
crosstudio
New member
All you are measuring is how high the noise in your track is (according to your input meters) once you get your mic pre to an acceptable level to record.
JuSumPilgrim
New member
Im pretty surprised at the typical levels here. I set my gain to get as close to 0db or -1dB as possible. I have clients do takes again if the levels are too low bec my room noise levels arent the greatest. Most of the levels quoted here are above 60dB??
Im getting -102dB with my NT2-->mindprint-->delta 1010...with the gain turned all the way down. With nothing plugged into the delta 1010 I get -106dB.
With the gain turned to a typical level for vocals, which is bet the 9 and 10 o'clock on the mindprint when recording vocals in my control room bec they sound better.. are bigger, deeper, etc ., Im at -74dB. In my tracking room the noise floor with the NT2-->mindprint--->delta1010 is bet -80 -84dB.
The levels in my control room are with some isolation of the computer (its in a desk CPU compartment that has a door that I have sonex damping lining the floor and wall of the cabinet..which doesnt really lower the noise that much but does change the frequency breakdown so that its all low frequency hum from 160 - 290Hz and so doesnt take away from the detail or depth at higher frequencies).
Recording vocals with the C1-->mindprint-->delta 1010 the noise floor is bet -68dB and -71dB, depending on the gain compression, etc. In my tracking room its around -74dB.
The major reason for the dif in noise levels bet these 2 mics has to do with the area of sensitivity. The NT2 has a tighter cardioid pattern than the C1 and picks up less room noise.
Also, keeping a 50Hz or 100Hz rolloff on is a good idea if you have any hum or low frequency issues. Ive gained 3-6dB more headroom this way.
Im getting -102dB with my NT2-->mindprint-->delta 1010...with the gain turned all the way down. With nothing plugged into the delta 1010 I get -106dB.
With the gain turned to a typical level for vocals, which is bet the 9 and 10 o'clock on the mindprint when recording vocals in my control room bec they sound better.. are bigger, deeper, etc ., Im at -74dB. In my tracking room the noise floor with the NT2-->mindprint--->delta1010 is bet -80 -84dB.
The levels in my control room are with some isolation of the computer (its in a desk CPU compartment that has a door that I have sonex damping lining the floor and wall of the cabinet..which doesnt really lower the noise that much but does change the frequency breakdown so that its all low frequency hum from 160 - 290Hz and so doesnt take away from the detail or depth at higher frequencies).
Recording vocals with the C1-->mindprint-->delta 1010 the noise floor is bet -68dB and -71dB, depending on the gain compression, etc. In my tracking room its around -74dB.
The major reason for the dif in noise levels bet these 2 mics has to do with the area of sensitivity. The NT2 has a tighter cardioid pattern than the C1 and picks up less room noise.
Also, keeping a 50Hz or 100Hz rolloff on is a good idea if you have any hum or low frequency issues. Ive gained 3-6dB more headroom this way.
crosstudio
New member
I can not see what my noise level is when my gain is turned all the way down, because my input meters only go as low as 98db.
the noise levels that you quote while getting your input meters to -6db or more is very good.
the noise levels that you quote while getting your input meters to -6db or more is very good.