OTB Mixing confusion

N

Nundale

New member
Hello everyone,

Just joined this awesome forum in the hope of inspiration and some help.

I just finished producing a new album (electronica/IDM) and am now entering the much dreaded postproduction phase.
I have a great mastering engineer, but the mixing I want to do myself.
I am quite hell bent on OTB processing.

But....

I am kinda lost in the way I need to set up my studio without having to shelf out the big bucks.
As far as I can see I have these options:
1. Route my DAW groups and tracks out through a channel strip one by one (since I won't buy 6 channel strips obviously)
2. Route my DAW tracks out onto a mixer with per channel eq/ dynamics and sum or group it in the mixer and bounce it back into the DAW

The first option gives me sweeter tuning options for that one track I am treating, but I can imagine that it will become a pain in the ass to do so track by track.
The second option gives me more flexibility and saves time, but such a mixing desk will never have the same circuitry as a sweet channel strip.

Again, I am not working with vocals and very little live instruments. It's mostly electronic instruments that need boost, clarity and seperation.

Any help and input is highly appreciated.

Thanks
 
Nundale said:
As far as I can see I have these options:
1. Route my DAW groups and tracks out through a channel strip one by one (since I won't buy 6 channel strips obviously)
2. Route my DAW tracks out onto a mixer with per channel eq/ dynamics and sum or group it in the mixer and bounce it back into the DAW

The first option gives me sweeter tuning options for that one track I am treating, but I can imagine that it will become a pain in the ass to do so track by track.
The second option gives me more flexibility and saves time, but such a mixing desk will never have the same circuitry as a sweet channel strip.

Again, I am not working with vocals and very little live instruments. It's mostly electronic instruments that need boost, clarity and seperation.

Thanks
Click to expand...

1 & 2...depends on the channel strip and the mixer you are talking about. There are diamonds and clunkers with both.

I'm also not seeing how you can "mix" multiple tracks...by running them one by one through a single strip, no matter how great the strip...?
When you mix, you want to hear all the tracks combined. Treat each with the strip, and then pulling it back ITB...that's going to a tedious, and possibly frustrating that may not yield anything you want...or it will take endless trial and error.
No if you think that simply running each track through the same strips settings will somehow impart some "magic" on them, making them all sound sweeter when you do mix ITB...well, again...it's going to take a lot of passes and trial and error...but a mix is done of all the tracks combined. That's the best way to "glue" them and know what you have with the "mix".

If you are dead-set on OTB...you need multiple strips or a mixer, and frankly, I would opt for the mixer because it lets you mix. :)
 
Hey miroslav,

Thank you so much for this honest answer. I was thinking the same thing. The channel strips I tend to like are all 2.5k a pop. I looked at my sessions, and I have a feeling that I will want to do mixing with at least 4-5 groups. Of course I could (and I will eventually) do a mixture of ITB and OTB and could use the strip just on let's say my drum group. I don't believe inmystical magic in a box, but I do believe in character, and if I could blow some character into some of the static electronic voices as a secret weapon, that would be more than welcome.

Desks I am looking at and that fulfill the "channel strip per input" prerequisite are the Presonus 16.0.2 or the Mackie ones. Presonus offers the Fat Channel, while Mackie is in the game with its own plugin suite, but then again, that's going all digital just with a fancy controller...
Damn, I am stuck here
 
Most of the desks sold at this price point are digital and wont add any magic that you cant do ITB . For analog desks the premium for high end is going to be approx. 5-15 x the price of digital per channel. If you are just looking for analog summing to give it that "flavor" and glue I would suggest parallel out to a good analog unit (2-BUS LT - Dangerous Music) like a summing mixer or a dual analog channel strip or compressor. Return back ITB and record to new stereo or dual mono then mix to taste. If you have a large enough music store near you I think you will find you could actually just rent something per project that way you can find something you like with less money. There is a large studio near Nashville that rents all over the world ( Ive seen video of their gear, drool). I have to say though, most of that genre don't usually benefit from what you are trying to do. Usually a little tape emulation(plenty types recommended in this forum) and a lot of frequency cutting to reduce the space so many electronic instruments take up by themselves, all done ITB. Heck if you just want color why not take a couple of sends out through some decent direct boxes with transformers and back in. You'll get that lovely added harmonics/squash for little cash. Again mix with untreated tracks to taste.
 
Well...your other option is to get one strip and then record tracks through it for whatever character you want...though of course, once recorded that character is part of the track, so you can remove it, and if it's not right, you have a harder time adjusting things when you mix it.
That said...a little character can go a long way without totally locking in some undesirable sound...IOW, you should be able to make adjustments and get things to fit later when you mix those tracks...just go easy on the way in.

All that said...you can get a lot of character staying all ITB too. There many great plugs out there. I don't find that adding one thing OTB to an other all ITB mix really has all that much impact. If you want some of that analog/OTB stuff...you kinda want to have a bit more to work with than one strip or one whatever.

I do a lot of hybrid stuff...but first off, I track everything to tape, so that whole process is all OTB...then I dump the tracks ITB, do my edits/comps, pre-mixing and pre=processing...and then I'm bring all the tracks OTB and run then through a console, plus additional OTB gear...so there's a substantial merging of both digital and analog technologies, and their sonic footprints on the tracks and the mix. Of course...it's a pretty involved studio setup, so not something you can throw together easily.

Get your strip if you really feel it will work how you expect. I don't think the Mackie or the Presonus will add a whole lot of OTB/analog "mojo"...which is why I say, just stay ITB if that's the extent of your budget.
 
At the risk of starting an argument, unless you have the budget to mix OTB properly (which would involve an interface (D to A) that could output all tracks at the same time) plus a mixer of suitable size, I'd strongly recommend sticking to ITB for now. I'm pretty sure you'll get better results more easily than trying the various bodges being talked about for OTB.
 
Bobbsy said:
At the risk of starting an argument, unless you have the budget to mix OTB properly (which would involve an interface (D to A) that could output all tracks at the same time) plus a mixer of suitable size, I'd strongly recommend sticking to ITB for now. I'm pretty sure you'll get better results more easily than trying the various bodges being talked about for OTB.
Click to expand...

The OP has also posted the same question at SoS and has received much the same responses including yours Bob!

One thing not so far said was IF he wants faders to twiddle, MIDI surface?

Dave.
 
Going ITB

ecc83 said:
The OP has also posted the same question at SoS and has received much the same responses including yours Bob!

One thing not so far said was IF he wants faders to twiddle, MIDI surface?

Dave.
Click to expand...

Correct, I posted it wherever I was hoping to find solid answers, which I am finding. It's more that I want confirmation for my choices and gut feelings, although I must admit that I am very much a hardware person and thus not very comfortable with the idea of leaving such a creative process entirely to mouse and computer screens.
Anyway I mixed one of my tracks last night entirely with my plugin suite and ran the drum groups through a warm audio opto compressor and some of the hihats through an aphex exciter. The result was very pleasing and I think that's the route I am going to take for this album.
I currently have an audiofuse with 12 outs and 12 ins going into my mackie, so I am okay with interfacing.
 
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