new studio need help.. fast!!

Readytodothis

New member
Ok... Let me try to be as quick as poosible..
This is what i'm thinking about..
I've been trying to piece a studio together in my mind... I think I understand midi.. at least a little... the concepts of channels.. polyphony.. multitimbral...etc..

This is what I don't get and excuse me If I sound like an idiot but... I get a midi synth keyboard 16 channels.. 16 timb.. 64 polyphony.. and maybe another synth module.. 16 channels same as the keyboard... I can make hypothetically 32 tracks of different sounds... A computer sequencer can make them play and record...and change etc... A sound card and midi interface can have so many in's and out's.(but that's midi right.. not audio) And everything gets ran into the computer edited.. recorded vocals and etc..
the sound card plays a big part.. I know!

Anyway ,
My question is : If I can do all of this with computer where does the track board come in...? I originally thought that these "pro" synths and sound modules..(for some naiive,odd reason) Had sixteen audio outs,If they were sixteen channel midi.. I'm lost... I want to be able to use a 20 track mixing board... But how do I assign let's 16 tracks.. one for snare one for kick.. one for strings.. one for another set of string.. one for.. etc.. These keyboards have two audio outs.. Left and Right...
Like I said, maybe I am an idiot, or just ignorant to the procedures of having my own studio... It isn't as easy as paying to use a proffesional one with an engineer to wire and adjust.. All I know.. is.. In the studio Sounds came from the same module, or the keyboard or sampler... or whatever.. the were seqeunced by a sequencer and ran into the board... A patch bay? yes I understand that ties in there somewhere... but where.. do my tracks come from the computer or the instruments.. I don't know... I'm assuming I don't need 16 keyboards to do 16 tracks on a mixing board.. and a 300 dollar sequencer..
I'm pretty sure one of you will answer this with a few words, wondering why my question was so long... I'm lost..
 
Great that you want to try this all out, but it sounds like you might want to learn some basic theory on midi, how it works, and the difference between midi and audio. My suggestion is to look at your local book or music store and find something that'll do this for you. Oh heck, I'll look up a website for you...just a minute.

OK I'm back--this one doesn't look too bad:
http://diamond.idbsu.edu/GaS/midi/html/midi_intro.html
 
Thanks Tapehead...

I think that I read that already...
Maybe I was being a little hesitant to say this, (My ignorant theory)but it seems like I don't really need a mixing board with the right software and the right soundcard... Just didn't want to say that! AM I RIGHT OR WRONG :( ?

That was really my quest. in a nut shell.. And thanks again.. I've been reading all the pages I could on midi ever since this morning.. I guess that is my last quest., and then I'll leave you alone....
Unless, of course your answer opens a new one :)
But hey that's what this BBS is for right?
 
I don't mind answering but there's no need to shout. :)

I think I understand your question better now and the answer is no, you don't need an external mixing board. The audio output will be sent from whatever device you have placed last in your midi chain. Your soundcard is simply another synth module in that chain. In your sequencing software (assuming you are using computer-based sequencing) you mix your "instruments" and send these instructions to or through whatever devices you select. Hope this helps.
 
OK... That's what I needed to know...
But a few more questions if you don't mind..

On musiciansfriend.com They have an event Layla package with Alesis monitors, Layla,some software...whatever.. there was no mixing board.. and the advertisement said all you need to record on your computer... Now,I've been building(in my mind) my studio around 2 things the computer and track board($1000+.) Because in the studio they always used the sequencer for breakdowns and layout but they always ran individual tracks through the board.. for mixing.. Why? If I can eliminate that mackie board... And do it all with software.. I will... I guess my question is.. Are you saying that for small projects no mixer is neccesary... and if I want to do greater projects one may be needed. Or I will never need one again... I wont be recording live instruments.. often.. And if so.. I can record them one at a time right? Trhough the same line in as I would vocals..and then assign them as tracks on the sequencer... I know that was alot.. But I never had to do anything in the studio.. Except for playing and ocassionally using the software, and touching the board.. But never wire work or plugging in... I'm just trying to understand what I need...
If you can help me with that I'll be grateful. and also probably done hounding you for a while :D

Thanks TAPE HEAD :) or anyone who may want to take the burden of trying to explain all of this to me....
 
If you're going with fully computer-based recording then yes you can do everything in your computer, including adding tracks, mixing them, mastering, all the way to burning your CDs if you wish.

Lots of studios still run everything including their synthesizer outputs through a soundboard because it give you a tremendous amount of capability and flexibility as to what you can do with the signal. I.e. studio monitors, headphone mixes for the musicians, sending to and returning from effect and other processing devices...
 
That was all I needed to know...
Do you know anything.. Now only if I could find someone to tell me how a celeron500 mhz 128mb ram computer with a 10 gig. hard drive (with another hard drive to come) I would like to have the best digital audio card maybe the Layla... I saw that package you know... But It doesn't support the midi.. So I need another card right? what would be a goodcard.. I mean Layla is expensive... But I wanted something with a very good sound.. I've heard that the multimedia cards aren't thatgood(like turtle beach.) Are there any with digital and analog outs that do both midi and digital audio, that have price ranges that are worth it... I need a great sound is my computer up to speed...? If only someone could help me? :D Do you know any senior members? tapehead.? :rolleyes:
Please guide me.. ;)
 
Sorry for not getting back sooner; but I'd suggest you check out the midi section of this BBS. I'm by no means a midi expert but you'll find plenty of them on this board. Good luck!
 
Readytodothis,

MIDI is just a way to send/receive music instructions (information) to keyboards, sequencers and other "MIDI" devices.

To get your mind clear, think of MIDI as separate from audio recording. MIDI allows you to access multiple instruments and send or receive information from them (in the form of notes, etc...). It seems that you may be unclear on what a MIDI sequencer does apart from and audio recorder. A MIDI sequencer can be a computer program, within a MIDI keyboard or a stand-alone unit. When properly connected, a sequencer receives MIDI information from your keyboards (when you play a note on the keys) and sends information back to the receiving MIDI devices (your controller keyboard) or other sound modules. So your sequencer is the recorder for MIDI info.

MIDI sequencers record in banks of 16 channels. Many MIDI keyboards can simultaneously output 16 channels of MIDI data. So with a 8-instument MIDI interface, you can have 8 instruments capable of 16 channels each. That's 128 total instruments/programs = 8x16. By the way, MIDI info takes up very little space compared to audio.

Digital audio is altogether separate, although many programs like Emagic Logic Audio, Cubase and Cakewalk have BOTH MIDI sequencing AND digital audio. Audio is sound information represented by samples. A digital audio recorder gets info (sound) through a sound card or sound interface (for example - Layla, etc). When sound comes in, the recorder samples the sound. The higher the sample rate the more accurate the sound is compared to when it came out of its source (the keyboard). Sample rates are determined by how many samples per secong (frequency - measured in Hertz - Hz) So... a sample rate of 22.05 kHz is 22,050 samples per second. A higher sample rate of 44.1 kHz is 44,100 samples per second. So as you guessed it the sound is more accurate, because the recorder is taking more "pictures" of the audio each second.

To keep this short, "CD" quality sound is defined as 16-bit, 44.1 kHz.

Basically for doing what you seem to want to do, you will need BOTH a MIDI interface AND a sound card/interface. For a budget setup with one or two keyboards, you could use a $25 midi in/out cable on the sound card that comes with you computer. For digital audio you can use the audio "in" and "out" on your soundcard.

For a more advanced setup. You can get Layla, Delta 1010, Yamaha,Soundblaster Live or any of the other audio card/interfaces on the market for audio. AND you can buy a MIDI interface (for 2-8) instruments.

With that basis, I will try to answer your unspoken question. Why do I have only two outputs on an instrument capable of 16 MIDI channels? or Why do I need an audio interface AND MIDI?

In order to apply effects such as EQ, reverb (different from inside your keyboard), compression, etc... You may want to record your finalized MIDI information as audio. Most people do. So you would need to record the MIDI channels one at a time or multiple channels at a time depending on the number of inputs on your sound card or the way you want to group your instruments. For example, you may want to deal with all drum sounds as one stereo file. For this you would mute every MIDI channel except all drum sounds. Pan the sounds how you want them. Balance them (as far as volume) and then record them as digital audio. You could theoretically do this with each instrument or instrument groups. OR you may (for simplicity) want to dump the entire MIDI music track as one stereo file.

Just some ideas and info to get you started.

To recap, you need:
1. A computer
2. A sequencing program,
3. A digital audio recorder (or you could get a program that does both MIDI sequencing and digital audio)
4. A MIDI interface OR a MIDI in/out cable
5. Possibly a Mixer for keyboards, other instruments (guitar, vocals, etc.) and for routing sound to your Monitors (speakers)



[This message has been edited by Rev E (edited 04-06-2000).]
 
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