pearlnpaiste
New member
what is phantom power, how does it work, and where is it used.
dont really know
- Thread starter pearlnpaiste
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dkelley
Active member
I always thought that the reason it's called phantom is because it runs through the signal wires for your mic without requiring any additional wiring.
By the way, if you use a ribbon mic it will probably blow up with phantom power connected, so it has to be able to be turned off if you want to use a ribbon mic. Dynamic mics ignore it (don't need it), ribbon mics don't need it but won't ignore it (they'll fry more often than not), and condensor mics need it (although tube condensor mics generally have their own preamp that powers the tube and the rest of the electronics so phantom power isn't needed (and is probably ignored) by them as well). oh yes and some condensor mics can run off a battery instead (particularly electret condensors which aren't considered "true" condensors but do offer many of the advantages of condensor mics - which is another topic entirely).
the reason for power at all is that condensor mics have extremely low power output and therefore they all have built in signal amplifiers to bring the signal up to the levels of the common dynamic mic (to be compatible). This circuitry needs power, it's an amplifier after all.
Cheers
By the way, if you use a ribbon mic it will probably blow up with phantom power connected, so it has to be able to be turned off if you want to use a ribbon mic. Dynamic mics ignore it (don't need it), ribbon mics don't need it but won't ignore it (they'll fry more often than not), and condensor mics need it (although tube condensor mics generally have their own preamp that powers the tube and the rest of the electronics so phantom power isn't needed (and is probably ignored) by them as well). oh yes and some condensor mics can run off a battery instead (particularly electret condensors which aren't considered "true" condensors but do offer many of the advantages of condensor mics - which is another topic entirely).
the reason for power at all is that condensor mics have extremely low power output and therefore they all have built in signal amplifiers to bring the signal up to the levels of the common dynamic mic (to be compatible). This circuitry needs power, it's an amplifier after all.
Cheers
bennychico11
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dkelley said:
nah, it's because other microphones ignore it. electricity can run through anything that's a conductor...in either direction too. If you took a microphone cable and stuck it in a wall outlet, it'd still shock the hell out of you without needing any rewiring. But we wouldn't call that phantom power, would we?
this is an old myth, that is used pretty much for precaution nowadays. Older ribbons were wired differently, so yes, they could become damaged or stretched (not "blown up"). The only way it could probably harm your newer microphones (which is probably what you have, unless you're lucky enough to own a vintage mic) is if there is some sort of miswiring in the microphone in your studio. Here's a link from Royer Labs explaining these circumstances:
http://www.royerlabs.com/phantom.html
But yes, it's a safe precaution to follow....but so is not using ground lifts in your gear, and people still do that.
dkelley
Active member
bennychico11 said:nah, it's because other microphones ignore it. electricity can run through anything that's a conductor...in either direction too. If you took a microphone cable and stuck it in a wall outlet, it'd still shock the hell out of you without needing any rewiring. But we wouldn't call that phantom power, would we?
Um, well you may be right that I'm wrong, but I disagree with your explanation because the electrical trick involved in phantom power is to provide a 48v power line on the same wire to the mic that is receiving +/-300mv (or whatever) musical signal from the mic. It's just something that is neat, can be done, but isn't totally obvious electrically speaking. I believe it was called phantom power because it could go down the xlr line without any additional wires and power mics that needed it, while the other mics of the day (which were two wire dynamic and didn't often even used balanced wiring when phantom power was designed) didn't touch it.
Maybe I'm wrong...when the benefits of balanced lines became clear and everyone used xlr cables or at least balanced 3 wire leads, ribbon mics started blowing up. And by blowing up I mean becoming non-functioning, I never actually meant the explode. I used the term loosely, sorry for the confusion. There is a small audible pop from a ribbon mic that dies in this manner, so I supposed it could still be misconstrued as blowing up, just in a tiny way hahaha
bennychico11 said:
huh, I've heard that many modern ribbon mics still say this in their literature, and while I currently only own an older beyer 130 (which I'm not about to put any phantom power through), I wouldn't necessarily trust that the newer manufacturers of ribbon mics (including the chinese knockoffs) make them safe for phantom power. Every engineer I've worked with, at CBC studios or anywhere private, has always commented that it's a safe rule to follow that you don't put phantom on a ribbon. While you may be completely correct, it seems to be a safe tip, why blow up a ribbon mic like that? I've certainly heard a couple of stories in this forum of that very thing happening with new mics and old.
Anyhoo, apparently my comments were misconstrued - I was attempting to teach a beginner the safety and generally agreed upon rules of phantom power in a few words. I wasn't trying to change the mind of another experienced engineer, I'm acting in a helpful role in the newbie area. My own skills or experience aren't items that really matter right now. I'm quite correct in what I told him and stand by it in my own recording work as well. rules of thumb prevent catastrophes! :-D
Cheers man, good to see there are others here trying to help the newbies.
bennychico11
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Here's a document (opens with Microsoft Word or similar) of some archived posts of this board talking about phantom power....particularly how it works (should help the original poster).
http://www.hr-faq.org/phantom power and bias voltage.doc
(don't worry, should be virus free....at my antivirus found nothing)
Some are quotes from mic engineers, most notably David Royer. Some interesting comments on what they're doing with newer ribbons and how to protect older ones.
More specifically, a statement form Bruce Bartlett
Yes, I agree...it's better to be safe than sorry. Although, if it does accidently happen one time don't be freaking out that you may have ruined your brand new beautiful mic....as long as things are wired properly in your studio you should be fine.
But then again, I'm not an electrician...I just trust what other mic engineers/manufacturers say. But then so are you, so I guess we're stuck in an infinite loop here 
http://www.hr-faq.org/phantom power and bias voltage.doc
(don't worry, should be virus free....at my antivirus found nothing)
Some are quotes from mic engineers, most notably David Royer. Some interesting comments on what they're doing with newer ribbons and how to protect older ones.
More specifically, a statement form Bruce Bartlett
Yes, I agree...it's better to be safe than sorry. Although, if it does accidently happen one time don't be freaking out that you may have ruined your brand new beautiful mic....as long as things are wired properly in your studio you should be fine.
But then again, I'm not an electrician...I just trust what other mic engineers/manufacturers say. But then so are you, so I guess we're stuck in an infinite loop here
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