Would like some constructive criticism on a Pop Punk mix

samth3mancgp

New member
Hi I'm working with a Local Pop punk band in Maryland, but mixing in my dorm room in Tennessee at college. I'm using a ProTools M-powered on a macbook pro, project mix I/O, Black Lion Audio, Microclock mkIIl, and KRK Rokit 8s for mixing. Drumagog is the latest plugin that I have invested in which you will hear a lot of on this mix.. all drums are samples except for the overheads, hi-hat (basically all cymbals) and maybe the toms if I remember right.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=K9ZGXZAF

The song is Called My Heart's In Your Headphones.

Some people have already told me that the vocals are sitting slightly too far back in the mix, but this mix wasn't focusing on the vocals as much. All the girls that will listen to this song will only care about the vocals anyway so I'm gonna give them a little extra attention in a later mix.

Any helpful criticism would be appriciated! :)

EDIT: jeez I forgot to add that the lead guitar is sort of in the background too because it is.. rough to say the least. I will be redo-ing those parts myself.

by the way, This band has done 9 other songs with me I think? Including one cover. Some of them aren't even going to be used i think? It's been a lot of work so it's all just starting to run together haha.

EDIT 2: and there's alot of weird stuff at the very end of the song. Just a heads up. You'll thank me for the warning!
 
Pretty good! Just a few suggestions for you:

  • I agree the vocals need to be more upfront. I kinda got used to the vocals as the song went on, but it would be better if the mix was more focused on them.
  • It sort of seemed like the guitars were slightly hiding the drums--some of the crashes sounded like splashes and I couldn't fully make out all the fills.
  • I'd turn up the bass throughout the whole song just a tiny bit.

I'm looking forward to hearing the final mix of this!
 
Thanks man! That "splash sounding cymbal" is probably this small Sabian AAX china. I may pull the guitars back a bit once I redo that lead guitar track. I'm not sure when I'll be getting back to that song but here's another one. It's a cover of a Blink-182 song. The mp3 attaching isn't working for me so I'll use another mega upload link. This song also has terrible sounding things at the end i'm sorry. Even WORSE. Things that include the drummer talking like donald duck, and the singer passing gas into the mic..... I just make sure I'm capturing the sound well... I don't have any control over what that sound may be unless it is damaging to the equipment of course :spank: :eek:

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=IOYCD12S

The last song had DI guitar tracks using POD Farm but this song was a Peavey Vavleking Head going into a Mesa Cab. I used a Sennheiser e609 and Shure SM57 close micing the cab. Then I used the AKG C414 that I was using for vocals on the other side of the "iso-closet" to pick up some room ambience. The guitars were doubled and panned hard left/right. The signal chain for the guitar varyed between songs and so did the guitars being used but I double tracked the rhythm guitars for every song no matter what.
 
Sounded good! No suggestions I can think of. What's the band called? And how did you end up sampling only some of the drums?
 
Sorry for the long time between replies. the band is called Go Home Freshmen and they are out of Frederick Maryland. You can find them on Myspace, Facebook, Twitter, all that good stuff. They just got together back in July of this year, but all of the members have had prior experience in other bands. They are all pretty good friends of mine that have been recording with me in their other bands for a over a year now.

I recorded each drum separately and from there I stuck Drumagog on just the drum track that I wanted to trigger and replace with a sample. It's usually just the snare, or the kick or both. never cymbals.

the myspace is.. www.myspace.com/gohomefreshmen

The mix of "Big Bang Theory" that is on their page is not the final mix, nor does it even include any lead guitar, or synth. Those rhythm guitar tracks are slightly out of tune with each other which is horrible. It was the first time I had taken the advice to double track the guitars. I actually didn't double track them, I stuck a separate take of the rhythm guitar from a different playlist on 2 new tracks that I created. (which explains why the parts do not match up properly.) I have learned sooo much from this project alone and I cant wait to do more work next summer. I'm a firm believer of that phrase I have seen on this forum a lot that says "If show a noob some tricks and he'll mix for a day, but if you spark an interest in him to search and figure it out for himself he will mix for a lifetime". I'm always searching! :cool:
 
Another song.. Another mix.

How does this one sound? :)

I spent a little bit more time automating the volume on this one. Even though I used a maximizer on it there are parts that push through the mix more than others.

This is a short song with a pretty dumb name haha.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=Y6EM3I55
 
hmm. It seemed to work for me. I cannot get the mp3 file attachment for these forum posts to work. It always gives me an error :confused: I would rather use the forum attachments than that sketchy megaupload site anyway
 
Hmm... now it's downloading but stopping halfway through the download. I tried it in two different browsers. Do you think you could upload it somewhere else?
 
(I'm listening to the most recent mix)

Wow... My first impression is - this is really messy. really.

The guitars and keyboards (if you're using keys... Might just be another really weird sounding guitar) blend together way, way too much in the background. Give them each their own space.

The drums sound super compressed, squashed and almost dead because of it.

Timing issues when the song slows down at the end.

Vocals are too hot on this one. With music like this, you've gotta have the music be loud, drums kicking like crazy, and have the vocals be heard and understood all at the same time. This mix's vocals were sitting on top of everything else, and that causes the song to lose the power the music brings, so... EQ the stuff a bit, give each instrument some breathing room, tuck the vocals back into the mix, but make them easy to understand. And man... The drums need a lot of work. They sound like they're dying under 2000 pounds of compression.

Good song, though! Keep at it.
 
Hey man. Thanks for the honest review of it. The "recent" mix is actually just a first mix of another song. I should have given this thread a different name because I have actually posted 3 different first mixes for 3 entirely different songs from the same band. I realized the vocals being too hot on the one you listened to a few hours after messing with this song. Things sound wayyyy different even if I just walk away for a little while. The synth tone is not my favorite... (I think it was a PRESET :mad::eek: tone on a microKORG synth.) The keyboard player insisted on using that tone even after lots of pressuring by me.

I already have the guitars panned hard left and right already. The drums are panned all over the place too. What are some suggestions to achieve "more stereo spread" and give each part it's own place? Should that whining synth be dead center, or more off to one side?

Another thing I would like to ask about is this lead singer's voice. His voice is very "deep" even though he sings higher notes. It's really hard to EQ it. I try to boost a bit more of the lowish-mids where the fundamental is but it becomes very overpowering. Even when I leave it flat it seems like it's too much. I ended up cutting a lot of it with an HPF. Any suggestions there?

I'm not looking forward to fixing timing issues. I like mixing things... but when it becomes "fixing" and not mixing, that's where I have a problem.

If you listen to the first song/mix I posted (different song) the vocals sit a little farther in the background. I think that vocal level is more of that "just loud enough to be understood" deal. I still have a bunch more tracks I may post on here.
 
I finally downloaded it - I agree the drums sound a little bit too compressed and flat. However, I think the messiness of the mix fits in with the genre. I don't know about you, but I really like the keyboard sound in the chorus.
 
Yea I think that argument can be made too. The "sh*tty" and uncontrolled sound is sort of part of the genre. That last song in particular is sort of going for that sound. But that still dosen't excuse the blatant mistakes with the drums and vocals. I was trying out a vocals-up mix but it didn't turn out as good as I thought when I saved it.

The guitar that was used was a really old 60s Epiphone Casino semi-hollow. The vintage sound of the pickups and the hollow-body made the Digidesign Eleven plugin sound pretty realistic. Those plugins need a little extra sometimes. That old hollowbody guitar definitely gave the tracks that sort of nice slushy sound especially with all the added distortion. The lead line that slides up that minor second crunchy interval to unison also adds a distinct crappy punk sound.

Oh.. and about that synth. That song is my favorite song with synth in it. I know which part you are talking about. I love that part it is turned up just a bit more than the rest of the synth track. I think that I figured out where to give the synth it's own space. The synth patch has a mess of frequencies all the way up in the brutal high end. (like 8-12k). I think I need to back off the low-mids and the high mids that end up clashing with the guitars a bit and use that really high end of the synth. It gives the track a little bit more air and shimmer. I used this idea on this next mix I will post in a moment.

Here it is! I took the advice for the drums in this song/mix, as well as the vocals being down a bit more.

This one is called "Big Bang Theory"

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=B8LDPSKI

The mp3 attachment option for the forum post still isn't woking for me. these are all under 10mb I think. :(

It's definitely not perfect yet, I have noticed a few minor things mostly with levels.
 
I think this is the best one you've posted yet! The vocals could still be knocked down a little more at some parts of the song, especially around 0:53, but it's pretty good for the most part. You did a real nice job with the vocal tracks at around 4:00 minutes in. It can be hard to mix two different tracks with different timing and different melodies, but you did great with it.
 
Thanks man! I needed a bit of a reality check with that honest review. I sometimes just get into a rhythm of things and end up processing things too much etc.. I forget to experiment and just end up doing what has worked in the past. Every song is different. especially with this band.

For Example....

Big Bang Theory was tracked back in Mid-june. the lead guitars have been re-done 3 times (this last time was me doing them due to tuning issues. :laughings:). The rhythm guitar has been re-recorded 3-4 times now I think? The bass was comped from about 5 takes. (I just told him to play it a few times and i would take the best from each track. Vocals have been added, removed, changed, had different people singing. etc. It's been through hello say the least.

It's not that they are bad, when they started off they picked up a kid who was a really good player, but was new to pop punk. I ended up working with him in writing parts etc. They just want the best I could give them so I worked them hard. :spank:
 
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