Stereo Miking techniques...

tubedude

New member
Damn this junk... I spent 20 minutes typing this in, and then it says I'm not logged in and totally loses everything I typed. Asshole servers.
Anyway... more questions... I get type em all over again.
Scenario: Stereo miking a speaker, 2 mics.
Questions:
Side by side, pointing at same place? Space between them?
Pointing at different areas?
Are identical mics important?
Recording this way is better because... ? (opinions here)
Panning questions:
On a stereo digital track, they automatically pan left and right. Should they be hard left, hard right, or somewhere in between?
It is said that panning a stereo track around will collapse the image, but not when using a rotation control (the Blumlein method, I believe) like the S1. Any comments on this, and why the rotation DOESN'T collapse it?
I read also somewhere that if you place a mic about 8-12 inches behind the other one, pointing at same spot, that there will be a natural delay between the 2, thickening things up some. Is there a known general distance (measurable) from a speaker to make sure things are in phase, and known "out of phase" distances.
And last, but not least... would it be beneficial at all, if you had the capacity, to say... stereo mic a snare or toms or other drums?
Paul
 
mic placement hoedown

I usually start by placing a dynamic mic close to the best sounding speaker cone (grill cloth off) pointing at the cone (not the dustcover). I then place a condenser mic in the room 6 FEET (not 6-12 inches) away from the cab.

Now the fun begins.

Even minute changes in mic position will result in dramatic differences in the sound. I will point the mic closer to the dustcover, closer to the edge, at different angles, etc. Until I find which position this particular speaker and mic like. I do the same with the room condenser. i.e. point it at the wall, point it at the speaker, point it at the floor. I also will walk around the room and listen for the place where "it all comes together" and stick the mic there. Flip the phase on your desk/DAW/pre/etc. When it sounds "beefier" leave it in that position.

These are not secrets or uncommon. What I'm describing is what happens in studios all around the globe. Even right now some engineer somewhere is searching for the G-spot. Think of your microphone as a combination flashlight and third ear. Where you point the flashlight is where you get light. Wherever you hear cool stuff, stick a microphone there (yes, even there). I bought a laser pointer to aid in distant mic positioning, I use it constantly. It's also cool for finding reflection areas. Also, don't be afraid to put a mic behind the speaker or cab, or over the players shoulder.

Multiple mics close to the speaker can be a bad thing, you get all kinds of phase cancellation. Some engineers swear by this technique, I haven't found it useful. Except for trying different mics. I'll position a buch of mics close to the speaker and mute/unmute each mic til I find one that sounds best. Sometimes two together will sound good, but most often, one mic will stand up and say "ooh, me, me, me!"

After you have done these things a few million times you discover what works best in most situations. You know that sticking the mic 45 degrees off the corner of the cab just doesn't sound very good (except when it does). And you go for the positions you have learned will yield good results faster.

I interned at an old school analog studio for two years, I recommend hanging with more experienced guys in your area. Buy 'em a beer and pick their brains, sit in on some sessions, learn some stuff, multiply and replenish the earth.

Tom Cram
dbx Senior Technical Support
(801) 568-7530
tcram@dbxpro.com
 
There is no rule on stereo field panning.... I like my rythmn guitar recorded with 2 different mics.... (try mixing up the brands).. then I pan wide stereo on these two tracks... and you get a slightly different sound from left as opposed to right...cause you used 2 different mics... Then I put lead guitar right down the centre.. (most times).... about placement, and stuff, Toms post has some excelllent points about placement, and the phase shifting... I also dig the laser pointer idea..

Joe
 
More on (moron?) mic technique

My latest favorite thing to do is to have a close miced cabinet set up in a padded closet. Then have a distant miced cab set up in an ambient room. Again, not a very innovative technique, but it sure as hell works. I have the guitarist double track the part resulting in four tracks (2 ambient, 2 close dry), I pan the ambient tracks hard left and hard right, then I pan the 2 dry left and right 30 or 40 degrees. This has been my favorite technique for several years.

Just FYI Tubedude, this thread probably really belongs in the microphones section.

Tom Cram
dbx Senior Technical Support
(801) 568-7530
tcram@dbxpro.com
 
tubedude,
I've never heard of anyone stereo micing a snare drum or individual toms and that would probably be a little difficult to do (but I bet it would sound awesome on the snare!). Usually you have individual mics on the each tom and pan them going from one speaker to the other as you move across the drums, as if you were actually sitting in front of a drumset. So it probably wouldn't do to much to stereo mic the toms.

Funny, I was going to post a cool guitar cab micing technique I heard on a different thread, about having your close mic and one 8-12 inches back (in pointed at the exact same spot and at the same angle). Then copying and pasting the distant one another track and panning them right/left while leaving the close mic panned center, then reversing the phase on the distant mic.....I "was" going to post that ;) but then I realizied that it was your post to begin with tubedude....so it probably wouldn't do much good to post it now that's why I'm not going to post it. Just thought you'd like to know....cool idea BTW.:)

One more thing; when your computer starts to screw up like that (which mine does repeatedly) just copie the message then close down your internet program and when you open it back up paste your message again that way you don't loose everything and have to type it over (I even copie it everytime I hit the submit button just incase it decides to mess up then and doesn't let me come back).

-tkr
 
:)

Yeah, the snare was the main thing I was thinking about. If there was only a way to trick mic them. Maybe panning it left, and using a trigger for a different snare sound right.... I dunno... experimental stuff I guess... no rules!
It screwed all the way up... I tried to post, and it said log in, wouldnt let me go back at all, said the page expired... sucks...
Thanks Tom and everyone.... more stuff to try....
 
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