Learning the Ropes - Narrow Sounds

sjdean

New member
Hi,

Im a bit of a noob to mixing and mastering. Having written a couple of songs that Im quite happy with, I now want to mix and master. Considered farming it out to someone else, but I think I'd get a lot more fun to do it myself. So Im slowly learning but trying to quickly get to grips with everything. Im going to try and keep it away from newbie questions like what's a limiter or compressor or where to set bands for multiband compression - I can Google those.

To let you know what Im using, Im using Acoustica Mixcraft 6, iZotope Nectar 2, Ozone 5 and Alloy 4 for Vocals, Mastering and Mixing. I have a pair of M-Audio BX5-D2 speakers.

I bought the speakers as I couldn't get great results from the Behringer head phones I had - I felt they were too bassy. I have some in ear headphones whcih gave similar results to the car speakers as a way of testing but felt it too much of a hassle to keep running to the car with my memory stick so bought the speakers.

I get great results on the monitors, but when playing back in the car, I notice one of two issues. The sound - especially the guitar and vocals are too squashed. Not in terms of compression or headroom or anything, but in terms of a narrow band. It sounds like everything is in the middle and going through a tin can, sort of a prominent 500Hz to 1000Hz which is making things sound a bit "horny" and very flat. Scooping out that range just really makes it sound off. Im sorting it out slowly adding more "air" applying more db at higher EQ arounnd 5khz plus. I gather 500Hz to 1000Hz is low mid?

My second biggest problem, as Im using ToonTrack EZDrummer, the Ride Cymbals are too loud. They sound alright on the monitors, but in the car, the ride cymbals are bright and crisp but too loud. There's no separate Ride Cymbal mic, it's all shared with the other splash and crash cymbals in the over head and room mics. Trouble is if I turn the overhead mic down too much, I lose the splash and crash cymbals. If I turn down the high EQ on the drum track, the drums and cymbals sound very flat. Maybe I should just EQ the overhead or room mics to reduce the prominence of the rides without affecting the air in the overall drum track.

Finally, I think my next question, how many EQ's and Compressors should I go through? Using Amplitube I already have an EQ on there. But then into the effects for example, there's Nectar 2 which has compression and EQ, then Alloy 4 for mixing which has EQ and Limited and Dynamics, then there's Ozone 5 which also has EQ, Limiters and Dynamics. There's an overlap between the products.

Should I be using all three as necessary to mix and master each track? Ozone has cool functions like reverb, harmonic exciter and stereo imaging which probably aren't that exciting really, just I don't know any better. But it does seem ludicrous going through so many channels. My gut feeling is to use EQ, Dynamics and Limiters from one product only on a track.

Maybe I should just use Alloy to get a basic mix on each track and apply Ozone to the overall mix?

Thanks
Simon
 
Hi,
The key to reliable and trustworthy monitoring isn't so much the monitors you choose. It's how they sound in your environment.

If, for example, you put the monitors in a tiled room, you'll probably find you're turning down the highs to get your mix to sound right, which will make it sound dull in the car player or wherever else.

Have you put much thought into how the monitors are positioned, calibrated (if there are options) and how the room is treated?
It's advised to keep monitor speakers away from walls and corners, to keep them at head height, and to have them pointed inwards towards your ears.
 
If your drum package is half decent you should be able to vary the amount of ride in the overheads and room... turn it up and turn it down relative to the overall volume. That solves your ride issue.

You seem to have an awful lot of software there. I'd be keeping it as simple as possible to start with. And not using any thing more than I have to. If you don't know why you're adding compression, don't, for instance. And just because there are lots of shiny toys to play with, don't think you have to apply them all. Start simple. Apply less reverb than you think you need. Keep distortion effects wound back a bit.. etc. etc. Until you understand how to get to where you want to go sonically. Jump in and do a mix.

When you've got something, post a sample in the MP3 clinic, make a few friends there, take a deep breath, check your ego and pride and learn. You'll get more out of correcting something you've actually done via feedback from some of the excellent ears that hang there, than out of theoretical discussions here, although obviously they're useful for getting some operating guidelines happening.

Good luck.

---------- Update ----------

Oh... and you can always turn individual hit volumes down in your midi editor too... for the rides... many ways to skin that cat.
 
Armistice already answered about the cymbals - in EZ Drummer, you need to go into the MIDI editor and adjust the individual volumes on hits there.

To Steen's adivce - learn your monitors. Play some reference tracks, professionally-released songs, thorugh the system and learn how they shape the sound in your room. From your descriptions, you probably don't have any acoustic treatment (bass traps) in your room, which can really skew how your mixes sound. Note that listening to yoru mixes on various systems is a good way to learn how to make your mixes sound good on mulitpole systems, but typical car audio systems (unless you have a sub) have very little low end response.
 
I would keep the programs a bit simpler.
I've never touched anything besides the plug-ins that Pro Tools gives me and I've never heard a professional complain that the built-in plug-ins are anywhere near unusable.

Use exactly seven EQs and four compressors.
There's a saying in German that means "a dumb question gets a dumb answer" ;)
 
Hi all,

Thanks for the messages and advice. I went back home and stripped things out. I started loading up some of the other tracks I was having problems with and played them in Mono. I noted the same lacklustre quality I have in my car. I figure Im suffering from a phase problem and hit on the idea of mixing in Mono and mastering in Stereo. In really does highlight all sorts of EQ problems. So I work out each track and find the sweet spot for EQ etc and get it sounding good in mono. Work things out overall and make sure even after mastering it sounds crisp and clear in mono, then I can untick the Mono tick box and get a good stereo mix.

Does that sound good?

I've dropped the volume of the hi-hats and lowered some volume on the overhead mic boosting EQ at 3khz where the splash's and china cymbals sit. Applied a de-esser around 3.5khz. It's starting to sound good, but now feels a bit lacking on the treble side of things.

So Im happier, Im starting to get a good feel for the sound of the speakers and beginning to hear them.

Hope to post a couple of samples soon.

One thing Im not sure about, limiters. I apply a small limiter to each track before the output so that I standardise each track. They all have the same intensity at the moment so i don't want too much difference due to bad playing! So a small limiter with with the threshold at the peak and the margin set 6db above works for me right now. Whether that's right or not, I don't know.

Thanks
Simon
 
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