I thought I figured it out, maybe not...

R

rvriccardi

New member
Hi all,

I was using my home stereo as a monitor when mixing/mastering, but what sounded good on my home stereo sounded terrible everywhere else. :(

A few weeks ago I decided to buy monitors so I can accurately mix my projects so they sound good on most stereo systems. I read many reviews and decided that the only "true" way to find the right monitors was to go to the store and listen to them.

I visited my local Guitar Center and listened to about 15 different monitors using the same song on each one. As I listened to each monitor I noticed some were cleaner sounding than others, some had a lot of bass, some were flat sounding. Price wasn't a major concern so I just went by what my ears told me. I liked the KRK Rokit8 the best. The Rockit8's didn't overemphasis bass or treble, the sound was very clear and the instruments were easily identified.

I've mixed various projects using my new monitors including live studio recordings and projects where I laid multiple keyboard tracks (bass, organ, guitar, etc.) and multiple drum tracks (kick, snare, toms, overheads, etc.). My final mixes sounded full, clean and clear through the monitors. I burned a CD and played it through the monitors and it sounded just as good. :)

-now the problem- :eek:
I put the CD in my home stereo which has a sub-woofer and the bass was overwhelming and the overall sound was very muddy. I then put the CD in my car which also has a sub-woofer and got the same results. Next, I put the CD in a regular home stereo, the sound wasn't as muddy but there was still too much bass and it sounded somewhat distant. Overall the CD didn't sound as good as when it was played through my monitors. I also experienced different volume levels on each song, which wasn't that noticeable on my monitors.

Question:
1) Since my mixes had too much bass, should I be mixing through my monitors with very little audible bass?
2) Should I be using the VU meters to set the db level roughly the same volume in stead of my ears?
3) Is this just a matter of getting use to my monitors?

Thanks for the help :o
 
You failed to mention whether, or not you have any acoustic treatment in the room you mix in. Room acoustics should be considered first. It doesn't matter how good your monitors are, if the acoustics in the room are bad, your mixes will be negatively affected.
 
Yep, room treatment can help. Also spend some time listening to finished CDs that sound good in your car and on your home stereo through your monitor setup. Try and get a sense for how things sound. Other tricks are to occasionally check things on headphones, and walk around your room some to see if there are any obvious anomalies.
 
AlexW said:
and walk around your room some to see if there are any obvious anomalies.
Click to expand...


Yes, if you hear loud booming bass in one spot and no bass in another, then you have problems that need acoustic treatment. Also, if you can sit at the mixing position and hear echoes, or reverberation when you clap your hands, then that will need to be addressed also.

Learning your monitors is also critical... Play lots of commercial CDs that you like through them at different levels.
 
I have the KRK's rockit 5's and I am not happy with them at all. The mixes sound great on the KRK's, but nowhere else. I'm getting tons of high end on the KRK's, but none in other systems. They are not very good. I'm taking them back, and getting something else.

tim
 
I have heard that the KRK V2 series monitors are much better than the Rokits. Of course they cost more, but I heard the V8's translate well.
 
rvriccardi said:
1) Since my mixes had too much bass, should I be mixing through my monitors with very little audible bass?
2) Should I be using the VU meters to set the db level roughly the same volume in stead of my ears?
3) Is this just a matter of getting use to my monitors?
Click to expand...
1) Not yet.
2) Never mix for sound quality by meter.
3) That's probably a good chunk of it.

The responses so far are on spot as far as making sure your room is not a big problem.

However, if it sounds good in your room and too bass-heavy elsewhere, that sounds like the opposite problem of bass modes in your room affecting the mix. If you had a bass mode at your listening position that was abnormally pumping up the bass, that would tend to cause you to compensate in the mix by damping the bass, not amping it. This would make the mix weak-sounding in bass when played elsewhere.

For that reason, I'd - along with checking the room acoustics as well - check a couple of other things. First, make sure you're mixing with you monitors set at a proper volume. Too high or too low and that'll affect how you hear the mix. The textbook says you should be monitoring at about 83-85dBSPL to get the proper bass/treble balance, though that is flexible +/-5dB or so depending on how quiet or noisy your room is otherwise and on how responsive your particular ears are. Put in lay terms; make sure you are listening loud enough during the mixes to get everything, but not so loud as to distort or fatigue your ears. Rent a sound pressure level meter if you have to, take some measurements at your listening position where your head is, and then make notes or as to where your gear settings need to be to mix at that volume.

Also, because the problem seems to be so pronounced on systems with subwoofers, I'm wondering about the possibility of subharmonic build-up on your tracks. On tracks that require little or no extreme low-end (e.g. hi hats, guitars, etc.) you might want to shelve off frequencies below 80Hz. Many mixers have this feature right on their channel strips. If you don't have that, you should have high-pass EQ capabilities on an EQ or EQ plug-in somewhere that will allow you to shelve. Apply such filtering to the individual tracks before you mix down, and not to the stereo pre-master. If you had a quality sub on you monitoring system, then you might be able to tweak the mixdown in the sub-bass freqs; but without a studio sub, you'll be operating blind in that regard and will just have to trust your mix with what you got.

HTH,

G.
 
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although ive never seen those monitors, #3 should probably be relevant. I'll bet you a shiny nickel your second mix sounds better than the first. or maybe they're just glorified home speakers. most likely you just need to do a few mixes on them.
 
Ron,

You already got the right answer, that the main problem is most likely your room. As for why your mixes sound boomy elsewhere, this is a very common problem. In many / most small rooms, there's a big null at the mix position somewhere between 80 to 120 Hz. There are other nulls, and peaks, elsewhere around the room too. But a big null smack in the middle of the "fullness" range is very common. So you end up making your mixes too bassy to compensate. The solution is to add as much bass trapping as you can manage.

--Ethan
 
Ethan,

You mentioned addin as much bass trapping as I can manage. I went to RealTraps and I'm really confused as to what I need.

This is a layout and specifications of my room. Where and how many bass traps should I use? Will bass traps increase the bass responce of my monitors?

Thanks
 

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I think you need to analyze what frequencies are gonne be problematic before you start installing any traps. Check out your room's dimensions and find your T60 for the frequencies of 125Hz, 250Hz, 500Hz, 1kHz, 2kHz, and 4kHz.

T60=0.05v/ST x Aave

T60 is the reverb time in second, V is the volume of the room in cubic feet, ST is total surface area in square feet and Aave is average absorption of surfaces within the room.

You'll probably have to google the absorption rate of common household objects.
 
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