Bass note is canceling kick... grrrr...

[YanKleber]

I have a tune that is a kind of underground rock with a constant beat (thump-thump-thump...) with bass and kick getting together (2 bass beats for each kick beat).

It is a simple bass progression (A-G-F#-F) and each bass note is played 8 times (8A, 8G, etc...). When the bass is at A note kick sounds alright. But when it moves to G note the kick gets weaker and so on. Very irritating.

Any idea how could I correct this?

Thanks!

 

[Wish]

Flip the phase on either the bass track or the kick drum track, play it back, and see if the problem is still happening. There could be some phase issues.

My other thought would be some subtractive eq on the bass track to try and notch out more room for the kick drum.

You probably only want to apply these to the G trouble spots, and not to the entire tracks.

 

[Tadpui]

Agreed, an EQ notch would be a good thing to try (somewhere around the frequency of the fundamental of a G on the bass). Or you can try a sidechain compression technique to duck the bass guitar out of the way briefly when the kick hits.

However, I have a feeling that this is just a side-effect of the same issue that almost all of us face: low frequencies in a small room are an absolute bitch to deal with. Does the problem happen with the same notes if you stand up at your mix position? How about if you walk around the room...does the offending set of notes change? How does it sound in headphones?

 

[mixsit]

Interest question might be does the total low end energy reduce there? That could be a clue. Also, is there 'click in the kick track that could be used to help it speak there and keep it defined?

 

[mixsit]

.. Or you can try a sidechain compression technique to duck the bass guitar out of the way briefly when the kick hits. ..

That's a good one and it leads to another question- We're assuming here it's not due to their both hitting the same compressor? In that case maybe get in and pull some of that out with some side chain eq.

 

[YanKleber]

Hey fellows,

Thanks for the excellent inputs!

Tadpui has mostly nailed it and the issue is mainly in my mixing room (that has any acoustic treatment) since that when I hear it in my headphones the problem disappear.

Now look that and tell me if it is weird: right after to see that the mix sounded OK on phones I heard to it again through the loudspeakers but this time the problem didn't seem to be as noticeable as before.

It was REALLY bad last night when I started this thread. This morning, although it is still present it doesn't seem to be as obvious (probably if I wasn't paying attention I wouldn't notice). Is that possible that yesterday my ears were fatigued enough to make the problem appear to be bigger than it really was?

Another question: knowing now that the problem is more on my environment and not in the mix does it still worth to alternate the frequencies in the bass and kick?

PS: I am not using any compressor either in kick or bass.

 

[Jake_JW]

Hey fellows,

Thanks for the excellent inputs!

Tadpui has mostly nailed it and the issue is mainly in my mixing room (that has any acoustic treatment) since that when I hear it in my headphones the problem disappear.

Now look that and tell me if it is weird: right after to see that the mix sounded OK on phones I heard to it again through the loudspeakers but this time the problem didn't seem to be as noticeable as before.

It was REALLY bad last night when I started this thread. This morning, although it is still present it doesn't seem to be as obvious (probably if I wasn't paying attention I wouldn't notice). Is that possible that yesterday my ears were fatigued enough to make the problem appear to be bigger than it really was?

Another question: knowing now that the problem is more on my environment and not in the mix does it still worth to alternate the frequencies in the bass and kick?

PS: I am not using any compressor either in kick or bass.

Could be your ears getting fatigued, or your mind getting too zeroed in on one tiny detail and losing the bigger picture of the mix. Happens sometimes, but taking a break and concentrating on something else nearly always fixes it.

Listening to/for one thing constantly makes it seem overly obvious, which can lead you in the wrong direction.

 

[bouldersoundguy]

Try listening from different places in your room. Different parts of the bass will be loud or quiet depending on where you stand. If you spend time listening to a lot of well produced commercial mixes and walking around the room you can learn how different parts of the bass should sound around your room. I find this habit to be helpful in good rooms and necessary in more challenging acoustic situations.

 

[mixsit]

Try listening from different places in your room. Different parts of the bass will be loud or quiet depending on where you stand. If you spend time listening to a lot of well produced commercial mixes and walking around the room you can learn how different parts of the bass should sound around your room. I find this habit to be helpful in good rooms and necessary in more challenging acoustic situations.

!Yes!

 

[YanKleber]

Excellent advice Bouldersoundguy! I will certainly do that! Thank you!

 

[grn]

Try sidechain compression

I love problems like this... this is a more advanced technique, but you could use sidechain compression so every time the kick is hit it brings down the volume of the bass and if you adjust the threshold properly you won't even really notice the bass is quieter, but you will notice the kick comes through more clearly.

Here is a mildly helpful article: How To Use Sidechain Compression To Make Your Kick Drums Pop | Samples From Mars

 

[darscuzlo]

I'm with grn, I do that a lot with bass.

 

[grn]

I'm with grn, I do that a lot with bass.

And if the bass is getting too quiet on the kick hits I will add an extremely short delay on the kick... a la: Mix a pop song - 3 - Starting the real mix | AudioMelody

"Another bass drum trick worth playing with, is to mix the sound of a bass drum with a short delay. And I mean REAL short here – we’re not talking about 20-30ms here, no way… We’re talking about getting down to the 5,4,3,2,1 millisecond range. What this does is to produce a comb-filter effect on the bass drum that filters out some of the low end, whilst re-inforcing the top end."

If all else fails you can use a trigger... drumagog's a decent software trigger to replace the kick with another kick sample or if you recorded to a click track just program out kick drum hits with something free like hydrogen and layer it on top of the original track or replace it entirely.