Yet Another New Guy Wondering About Mastering.

Resurrect

New member
So, I looked at some previous threads about mastering hoping to glean information that could be useful to me. I was greatly disappointed. All I found was people ridiculing others (including professionals) for everything from compressors to volume level.

So here I am going to try to start a helpful thread. Below is a list of questions:

#1 What kind of mastering plugins are available for Reaper?
#2 How can I increase my volume? I know that most of you guys scoff at that. You're thinking, "here's another idiot hooked on his loudness. But seriously, dudes, my mix is too quite. When burned to a CD, and played through the car stereo, I have to crank the car volume all the way up to hear the song adequately. What can I do to fix this without clipping?

That's pretty much all the questions I have for now. Please stop being jerks and start giving some actually helpful feedback.
 
Gonna say something no one ever wants to hear --

#1 - Whatever plugins you want. However - If you can't get "so close" to where you want with the plugs that are built-in to Reaper, it isn't the plugin's fault.

"Mastering plugins" are whatever plugin you need to take the program material from where it is to where you want it to be.

#2 - Loudness is the easy part -- You can just ram it into a limiter. NO DOUBT, not all limiters are created equal and some work better on some material. But again, the built-in plugs in Reaper should be adequate to get you there.

THAT ALL SAID: How a mix reacts to "loudness abuse" is up to THE MIX more than anything else. Super-clean material with gobs of headroom at every possible stage is going to react totally different to material that was tracked too hot or mixed to hot or otherwise dynamically challenged from the start.
 
I was greatly disappointed. All I found was people ridiculing others (including professionals) for everything from compressors to volume level...

Please stop being jerks and start giving some actually helpful feedback.

Indeed. Thanks for speaking up. You're not in the minority with that thought...

So Massive is definitely right on. I don't use Reaper so I can't comment on anything about that specific program. But he is right that gain level, recording, and the mix itself are more accurate factors in the loudness of the track. I've been aiming to get rid of crazy loud transients in my mixes that spike many db's and make clipping unavoidable. I'm not the most experienced here, I'm the first to admit, but the logic in maximizing the mix levels to get better output makes nothing but sense. Cranking the limiter can be done, but I would advise to work on gain levels during tracking and the mix levels themselves.

Thnx for past comments Resurrect...got ya on SC dude.
 
If it's just for sharing among friends or posting/sharing from your SoundCloud page, try just feeding it into a limiter. JS Loser (included with Reaper) can do a pretty good job of "loudifying" to bring it up to a volume that allows it to be played alongside other music without having to crank up the speakers. It's not a pretty plugin, and I struggled to learn the relationships between a couple of the settings. But for simply making your mix louder, it's not bad at all. The Kjearhaus Master Limiter (another freebie, but hard to find nowadays) does a pretty good job as well. Not super-high fidelity or anything, but its a simple 1-knob stereo limiter.

If you're looking to distribute your mixes in more formal outlets (online streaming, CDs, etc), then I'd say pay a pro to do the mastering. There's no substitute for lots of experience, great ears, great gear, in a great room. The results will be superior to what most of us could accomplish in our basements and bedrooms.

But just for hobby-level stuff like most of us do around here, slap a limiter on the master bus, turn up the input until it's loud but not totally squashed, and if possible set the output limit to just under 0 dB. Maybe precede it with a gentle compressor that'll handle the bigger transients more gracefully. Some guys have great results from putting several maximizers/limiters in series, setting each one to shave off a little of the signal along the way. This can make for some pretty transparent limiting and minimal pumping. It's kind of what the RNC does on "Really Nice" mode.
 
While you can do it with a generic limiter an actual mastering limiter makes things much simpler.

Sometimes it helps to go back to the mix and place a limiter on one or two especially peaky tracks. If they're going to get squashed down anyway it's better to do it before it's mixed. That way the mastering limiter doesn't have to work so hard and other parts of the mix won't be as affected.
 
#1 What kind of mastering plugins are available for Reaper?
ReaEQ, ReaComp, and a JS "diode clipper" that I wrote is all I ever use. I usually have Voxengo Span on the Master also, but it's obviously not affecting the sound.

#2 How can I increase my volume? I know that most of you guys scoff at that. You're thinking, "here's another idiot hooked on his loudness. But seriously, dudes, my mix is too quite. When burned to a CD, and played through the car stereo, I have to crank the car volume all the way up to hear the song adequately. What can I do to fix this without clipping?
Control the dynamics at every step of the process from performance to tracking to mixing and then when you get to the mastering stage it should just be a matter of dealing with a few "aberrant" peaks that come up when everything accidentally pushes the same direction at the same time. Squash those down a bit and you should be good.
 
I've been using Waves IDR and it seems to work pretty well. I set mine to 0.3 peak and the as others have stated, set the threshold just where it dances, the objective to for it to kick less than 1% of the time of the song (That is just a guess, but I want it off more than on). If it is just bouncing every now and then, it seems to give me pretty good results. Until I learn differently (It's a journey right?).
 
One of the nice things about the Slate mastering limiter I've used, and probably some others, is the equal gain mode. You can compare the limited with the original while you apply limiting, but without the volume difference. Drive up the limiting while A/B-ing the two until you hear it start to fall apart, then back off a touch. Turn off equal gain mode and it's as loud as possible without excessive damage to the mix.
 
Now this all is some good advice! Thanks! Now it's time to go back to the DAW and start reworking all my songs. Thanks a ton everybody!
 
Get Izotope's Ozone 6 Standard. Their advanced version is an extra $400 - $500 and I've been reluctant to spend the $ on it because the standard version includes quite a bit and probably all you'll need. It has presets that do all the work for you including LOUDNESS (sonic maximize). Been using v.5 for a few years since it came with a Sonar Upgrade and I love it! PS: Just use their standard CD mastering template. Cheers!
 
Get Izotope's Ozone 6 Standard. Their advanced version is an extra $400 - $500 and I've been reluctant to spend the $ on it because the standard version includes quite a bit and probably all you'll need. It has presets that do all the work for you including LOUDNESS (sonic maximize). Been using v.5 for a few years since it came with a Sonar Upgrade and I love it! PS: Just use their standard CD mastering template. Cheers!

Ugh...

I understand that the presets my work for you and others, but there are so many variables and different needs for different songs. Yes, you can get your project 'loud', but are you listening to what each and every song needs? For a basic home project, a preset may be all many desire. But there is much more to mastering than just slapping on an eq, comp, or limiter.

Unless every one of your tunes sounds exactly the same, it is not likely that it will work for all and every track. And I sure hope that nobody ever has the exact sound for every track on a compilation...

Just my personal opinion. Whatever works for another is theirs.
 
Oh lord... I'll save my feelings about Ozone in general, but I would wholeheartedly recommend doing everything possible to AVOID those presets.

Do what the mix is telling you to do. If it isn't telling you, well, that's for another thread. Presets (especially the rather insane presets in Ozone - although they tell me they stopped using some of the more truly bizarre mix-wrecking presets where it would actually put a multi-band delay on the low end (?!?!??!?) but I haven't confirmed this) are for showing - again, usually in a somewhat 'extreme' manner, a plug's capabilities.

That said - If you have a mix that has the harshies at 3k and there's a preset that's called "Soften 3k harshness" you might be going in the right direction. But most of the "mastering" (cough) presets I've seen in several versions of Ozone are mostly multi-band mix trashers.

(EDIT) Ah - I see there was another page and J69 already ranted. :-)
 
90% of the time you can get by with one good eq and one good mastering limiter. Sometimes I add another subtle effect just to be different, but if a mix demands more than basic eq and limiting then it needs fixing before it's mastered.
 
I'm far from being an expert at either mixing, or mastering, but I have learned a thing or two about both, and my most recent lessons in mastering was not too many weeks ago.

I signed up to Lynda.com and did a Bobby Owsinski course that was super informative and only about three hours long. He talks about listening volumes, and having two reference volumes that are 12 db apart. Doing your work at the low volume, and using the loud volume to make sure it still sounds good after hearing the effects of the Fletcher Munson curve.

I watched a lot of Ian Sheppherd on Youtube.... He also talks about using two volumes when mastering, and he's really big on utilizing the same volume level when making your comparisons between processed and unprocessed tracks which brings me to my next point:

I have been using Wavelab Elements to try to master my stuff, thinking the whole time that the plugins provided there should really be able to allow me to set up a mastering chain that goes Gain (I downloaded a Bluecat Audio Gain device- my mixes were very quiet like yours) - Compressor - EQ - Limiter (In Wavelab I used the Peak Master). I had some moderate success with this setup and was actually fairly happy with a couple of the songs I had done when moving the finished product from sound system to sound system.

After watching the Bobby Owsinski video, he had made mention of a certain T-Racks plugin that could be handy, I believe it was the clipper. I went online to the IK Multimedia website and ended up buying the T-Racks Classic Mastering bundle. It was only $75 which I thought was a good deal, and it came with an Compressor, an EQ, a Clipper and a multiband Limiter.

I gotta' be honest, these items made my mastering so much easier than using the stock Steinberg stuff, you just can't imagine. I was able to use the compressor to increase the volume, without the aid of the Bluecat Gain plugin I had been using previously. The EQ had four bands plus a HPF and LPF where the Steinberg EQ wasn't quite as adjustable, only four bands, and if you wanted HPF or LPF you had to use one of the available bands, reducing the bands to three, or maybe even two, depending on what you're doing.

I haven't totally figured out the clipper yet, but the use of these plugins has just made mastering easier, and not only that you can use the software on a downloadable system the IK provides, whereby you can add your compression, EQ, etc, without affecting the perceived volume of your music, so you get a very accurate representation as to whether or not you're actually making your music sound better, instead of just making it sound louder.

I use them as plug-ins in Wavelab Elements, using the two volume (12db difference) approach and I learned from Bobby that you should use different monitors when mastering than you used when mixing.

Anyways, my story is getting long but the bottom line is this: I believe the plugins you use will make a difference to your success. I also believe that you would find the T-Racks Classic mastering bundle to be a way to deal with your volume issues, and get a good master at the same time.

But... That's just my two cents.

Hope it can help.

I have a whack of stuff to learn yet... But when things work well for me, I like to share the info.

Peace.
 
After watching the Bobby Owsinski video, he had made mention of a certain T-Racks plugin that could be handy, I believe it was the clipper. I went online to the IK Multimedia website and ended up buying the T-Racks Classic Mastering bundle. It was only $75 which I thought was a good deal, and it came with an Compressor, an EQ, a Clipper and a multiband Limiter.

I gotta' be honest, these items made my mastering so much easier than using the stock Steinberg stuff, you just can't imagine. I was able to use the compressor to increase the volume, without the aid of the Bluecat Gain plugin I had been using previously. The EQ had four bands plus a HPF and LPF where the Steinberg EQ wasn't quite as adjustable, only four bands, and if you wanted HPF or LPF you had to use one of the available bands, reducing the bands to three, or maybe even two, depending on what you're doing.

I haven't totally figured out the clipper yet, but the use of these plugins has just made mastering easier, and not only that you can use the software on a downloadable system the IK provides, whereby you can add your compression, EQ, etc, without affecting the perceived volume of your music, so you get a very accurate representation as to whether or not you're actually making your music sound better, instead of just making it sound louder.

I use T-Racks a fair bit, the 2 I use the most would be the 670 compressor and the clipper, the classic T-Racks EQ sometimes gets a go. I use the clipper to grab any wayward peaks that sneak through the compressor, the settings depend on the type of music and how hard it needs to hit, but usually never more then -2dB usualy -1dB (remember I have it at the end of the chain). I adjust the settings by ear, what sounds good is good, and as I do with all plugins if the clipper does not add anything or makes the mix sound bad out it goes. I also find the metering handy, which is a free download anyway.

I think for the price you can't beat the T-Racks packages.

Alan.
 
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