How to properly record rap vocals

brothathatcares

New member
Is there a particular technique that the artist must use when recording rap vocals? I've noticed when the artist that I record raps softly, he sounds more clear and it is easier to mix....

But when he gets loud, his vocals start to sound a bit "honky" and have a telephone like quality to them.... and it's almost impossible for me to get a good mix because of the sharp peaks in his voice...

The same holds true to the R&B artist that I record- when she sings softly I can get a clearer mix

I use the AT4050 and sometimes the Shure KSM32... both mics are new

I usually turn down his headphone mix to encourage him (and her) to sing softly, which then results in a mix that is easier to handle (I don't know if I'd ever be able to record and mix Lil Jon!!!)

Does anyone else have this same problem?
 
I use a 4050 regularly to record rap vocals and have never had this problem... Gain staging is a good point but if the rapper is "too loud" try using the pad on the mic. Likewise make sure the bass cut isn't turned on. Also you might want to consider using a little bit of eq and compression when you track if you don't already. Just don't over do it...

The "telephone like" quality is most likely distortion in you gain structure somewhere.
What is the rest of your chain?
 
It isn't so much that he is too loud, it's just that I noticed when he raps more softly, I can mix the vocals better...

On the other hand, when he gets louder, there are too many mid-range frequencies that get into my recording and that makes it harder to mix...

My vocals sound like they were recorded with a $40 condenser microphone, and I don't want that... Could my preamp be the problem?

I want my vocals to sound natural... I know that both of these mics (KSM32 and 4050) are neutral mics, so that would mean that I should be able to eq the vocals myself instead of having to work around a "honky" vocal...

By the way- I use a PreSonus TubePre, and I'm thinking that my preamp may be the problem, but I'm not sure...
 
By the way- I use a PreSonus TubePre, and I'm thinking that my preamp may be the problem, but I'm not sure...

I'm gonna say it's about 1/3 of the problem. It's not that great of a unit if you push it too hard. Keep the "drive" the whole way down and use as little gain as possible to get a good level.

Sounds like the bigger problem is that you need a "treated vocal booth" This can mean anyting from a prefab ($$$$$$) unit to throwing up some blankets and other absorbative materials. More that likely this will help you out more than a new pre will right now.... and can be done cheaper! ;)

If you want a significantly better pre (i.e. apparent better sound) you'll have to pony up at the very least $300 for a brick or something similar... and you'd still have the mid range issues from your room. Also this would probbably explain why they sound better at lower loudness from the rapper. Less level = less reflections.
 
btw... if you want to hear a 4050>tubepre sound that REALLY sounds like a telephone check out the first song "vicious."

Recorded from county on speakerphone.
 
Treating the room will solve a lot of your problems but not the immediate one.

If your artist can't control his dynamic range it's time to learn to use a compressor. I use them on the way in all the time just for the scenario you listed or adding color before the converters.
 
I think the artists aren't the problem. Dynamics don't have much to do with a "honkey" midrange and a lack of clarity. Compression and EQ would help what he has sit better in the mix though. I was just going for the problems as stated.
 
Ahh I missed that part of the post. Maybe he should look into a SE Relexion filter or something similar. I get excellent results with mine.
 
due 2 the imperfect circumstances, why couldn't you just drop it a few dB's around 500-900hz to get rid of your honky sound?
 
...when the artist that I record raps softly, he sounds more clear and it is easier to mix....

But when he gets loud, his vocals start to sound a bit "honky" and have a telephone like quality to them.... and it's almost impossible for me to get a good mix because of the sharp peaks in his voice...

Does anyone else have this same problem?


At 300 words a minute the main idea is to articulate.

http://www.write-out-loud.com/dictionexercises.html

Also bring our voice out of your throat and up to the front of the mouth...

If you're white and trying to rap - you better start moving those lips. Most often "cool" dudes trying to rap with their mouth barely open - blah - might as well make 4 songs out of that one song and sing it traditional way. Maybe then someone will understand...
 
Vadoom: U really don't like rap very much do u? lol

Brothathatcares: It definately sounds like an acoustical problem to me. I record R&B/Rap vocals all the time (including my own) and I've never run across that problem - even with amatures on the mic. Either u're recording too hot or your room is really bad.

I'm no acoustical expert, but I know a bad room when I hear one...
 
Vadoom: U really don't like rap very much do u? lol

Brothathatcares: It definately sounds like an acoustical problem to me. I record R&B/Rap vocals all the time (including my own) and I've never run across that problem - even with amatures on the mic. Either u're recording too hot or your room is really bad.

I'm no acoustical expert, but I know a bad room when I hear one...


Humm, not a big fan.

That link you have, I'm assuming you at least tracked and/or mixed. Right?
If so, my compliments to you! As far as the style goes, I can totally listen to this type of music... :p

I've listened to it about half a dozen times and if you are still open for criticism, I think the overall music seems a bit dry and/or a bit too centered. I think the background vocals need to be stereo expanded along with the string/pad that is part of the background music. I think this will add some spacial dimension as well as reduce the "dryness". I hear that the background vocals are already panned but the overall sound still seems up front and centered...

Other than that, I think the mix/music is very good! :)
 
Humm, not a big fan.

That link you have, I'm assuming you at least tracked and/or mixed. Right?
If so, my compliments to you! As far as the style goes, I can totally listen to this type of music... :p

I've listened to it about half a dozen times and if you are still open for criticism, I think the overall music seems a bit dry and/or a bit too centered. I think the background vocals need to be stereo expanded along with the string/pad that is part of the background music. I think this will add some spacial dimension as well as reduce the "dryness". I hear that the background vocals are already panned but the overall sound still seems up front and centered...

Other than that, I think the mix/music is very good! :)


Yes, I recorded, mixed, and performed the song in question. Thanks for the compliments and I think I have a thread (in the mixing clinic or something like that) for criticism.

As for the dryness, that's actually the sound I wanted. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying your opinion is off or anything...just explaining why it's dry. Not sure how much R&B you listen to but there's some songs that have a better feel when they're dry and in your face. As for stereo expanding (and this is a PERSONAL opinion), I don't really like using stereo/manipulation type effects. If I can't get it to sound big without it then I probably need to re-record or re-mix. But again, that's MY opinion. Some engineers get great results with that stuff.

But hey, I hear what you're saying though. Personally I thought there were bigger problems than the spacing - like the cloudyness (EQ and automation errors) after the bridge. Then again, maybe your advise would've helped on that. I'm still learning.

Thanks for the input and critiques. :D
 
Yes, I recorded, mixed, and performed the song in question. Thanks for the compliments and I think I have a thread (in the mixing clinic or something like that) for criticism.

As for the dryness, that's actually the sound I wanted. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying your opinion is off or anything...just explaining why it's dry. Not sure how much R&B you listen to but there's some songs that have a better feel when they're dry and in your face. As for stereo expanding (and this is a PERSONAL opinion), I don't really like using stereo/manipulation type effects. If I can't get it to sound big without it then I probably need to re-record or re-mix. But again, that's MY opinion. Some engineers get great results with that stuff.

But hey, I hear what you're saying though. Personally I thought there were bigger problems than the spacing - like the cloudyness (EQ and automation errors) after the bridge. Then again, maybe your advise would've helped on that. I'm still learning.

Thanks for the input and critiques. :D

Oh, yeah, no prob :)

Yeah, I think I hear the cloudiness... I think I interpreted it as "things in each others way"... Naturally I tried to move interfering things out of the way...
A tweak doesn't have to be anything significant - just a tiny bit to offset the "piece of the puzzle" just enough to make it sit well (or better) in the overall picture.

I think you have it really close to near perfect and that last tweak may not be obvious... Maybe if I listen to the song enough times... :D:D:D
At the end of the day, if that is what you like, then that is how it is going to be. :) But then I don't think it ever hurts just playing around... You can probably learn something new along the way... :D:D:D
 
Oh, yeah, no prob :)

Yeah, I think I hear the cloudiness... I think I interpreted it as "things in each others way"... Naturally I tried to move interfering things out of the way...
A tweak doesn't have to be anything significant - just a tiny bit to offset the "piece of the puzzle" just enough to make it sit well (or better) in the overall picture.

I think you have it really close to near perfect and that last tweak may not be obvious... Maybe if I listen to the song enough times... :D:D:D
At the end of the day, if that is what you like, then that is how it is going to be. :) But then I don't think it ever hurts just playing around... You can probably learn something new along the way... :D:D:D

Very true. However, that mix has already been mastered (costed me 125 bucks) and I can't afford a re-master...lol.

I just added my Soundclick link. There's a song there (Teaser1) that has a terrible mastering job (I did it...lol) but a slightly wetter sound. The cloudyness on that one is due to the L2 Maximizer settings - I just wanted to make it as loud as the other songs so it wouldn't stick out...
 
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