computer question - USB/Firewire/eSATA

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woody777

New member
I'm so confused!!! Can anyone direct me to a simple yet comprehensive website that explains USB 1.1/2.0 and Firewire A/B/400/800/4pin/6pin/9pin and now eSATA. I'm so lost it's not even funny...

I have a Dell Inspiron 1501 with 4 USB 2.0 ports and an expresscard slot. I'm in the market for an audio interface and an external hard drive to record to.

From what I read, firewire is the best connection for the interface and eSATA is the best connection for the hard drive. My laptop has neither :(

Option #1: purchase some kind of docking station/port replicator that would add firewire and eSATA capabilities. If such a beast exists, I cannot find it.

Option #2: use the expresscard slot to add ONE of the necessary ports. I cannot find a card that adds firewire and eSATA in one card.

Firewire 400 6 pin
http://www.techonweb.com/products/productdetail.aspx?id=C54284&src=FG
Firewire A/400/6pin and B/800/9pin
http://www.buy.com/retail/product.asp?sku=202730410&listingid=3928698&dcaid=17902
eSATA
http://www.directron.com/bteces2.html

So, if I understand correctly, transfer rates go from slowest to fastest as follows: USB 1.1, USB 2.0, Firewire 400, Firewire 800, eSATA - is that correct?

Are there only two types of Firewire? Firewire A=400 and comes in 4 or 6 pin and Firewire B=800 and comes in 9 pin? Are there any audio interfaces that support the faster Firewire B?

Since I don't think I can add Firewire and eSATA and I need firewire to record, how should I hook up my external drive? Firewire A? B? USB 2.0?

Sorry for the million questions!
 
If you are going to record no more than two tracks at the time, USB 1.1 should give you no problems. If you need more than 2 tracks, go to USB 2.0. Your laptop should have that, but confirm with the manual. Also the speed difference from USB 1.1 to USB 2.0 is huuuuge, but from USB 2.0 to Firewire it really isn't that much.
Hope I was helpful.
 
I know the speeds of USB 2.0 and Firewire 400 are very close, but I always read that Firewire is just most stable for audio/video work. Is that true or is it just a myth?
 
woody777 said:
I know the speeds of USB 2.0 and Firewire 400 are very close, but I always read that Firewire is just most stable for audio/video work. Is that true or is it just a myth?
Click to expand...

it's true, firewire also carries more info at one time. Esata is not necessary for an external HDD. but if you're doing HD video work you'll need esata. otherwise firewire is good for both the interface and the HDD. newegg has em for cheap
 
Vagodeoz said:
If you are going to record no more than two tracks at the time, USB 1.1 should give you no problems. If you need more than 2 tracks, go to USB 2.0. Your laptop should have that, but confirm with the manual. Also the speed difference from USB 1.1 to USB 2.0 is huuuuge, but from USB 2.0 to Firewire it really isn't that much.
Hope I was helpful.
Click to expand...

While the USB 2.0 audio spec doesn't blow goats as much as the 1.0 spec (which is an absolute train wreck), USB 2.0 is still pretty processor intensive. FireWire isn't. That's why USB 2.0 averages out at about 75% of its rated speed, coming in slower than FireWire despite being a theoretically faster bus....

I don't recommend USB 2.0 audio interfaces at all. USB is ill-suited for high speed data transport as designed. It's basically like taking a horse-drawn carriage, genetically altering the horse, giving it tons of anabolic steroids, and whipping it repeatedly so that it can compete at Nascar. In theory, it might be able to compete, but don't be surprised when it has a massive coronary on the 18th lap or so. :D

As for performance, the theoretical order is:

USB 1.x, FireWire 400, USB 2.0, FireWire 800, eSATA, FireWire 3200.

though the last one is not yet shipping in production silicon. Real-world performance is more typically:

USB 1.x, USB 2.0, FireWire 400, FireWire 800, eSATA.
 
yoyo said:
it's true, firewire also carries more info at one time.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure what you mean. FireWire carries audio in packets of whatever size the audio interface requests. That's entirely at the discretion of the FW/USB audio chipset vendor... unless I'm missing something.
 
I think what he means is that Firewire has a bigger bandwidth, and therefore can transfer stuff faster than USB 2.0
I'm not sure if the Firewire is more stable, but you shouldn't have problems for speed, since they are almost the same.
The Alesis Multimix firewire has 16 simultaneous inputs through firewire, and it also has a USB 2.0 version with the same features. So unless you are going higher than 16 simultaneous recording tracks, USB shouldn't give you problems, especially if you already have USB and not firewire.
 
Thanks for the replies.

So, what's the deal with Firewire 800? If that's twice as fast as Firewire 400 why does it seem like people aren't using it? Are most audio interfaces only Firewire 400 compatible? I can buy an expresscard with Firewire 800 ports... but can I even use it?

Actually, I can even buy a card that has one FW400 and one FW800 - would that make sense? And then get an external drive that has FW800 hookups? Or am I not understanding correctly... is the unit you're plugging in even dependent on what speed port you have?

Will an external drive with Firewire 400 be "good enough" to get the most out of my setup? I don't se myself recording more than just a few tracks at a time... but I will likely be using a fair amount of effects and plugins.
 
One point about FW interfaces is that you absolutely need to do your homework on which interfaces work with what firewire cards/chipsets and any OS problems. There are a fair amount of compatibility issues that should be researched before buying
 
woody777 said:
So, what's the deal with Firewire 800? If that's twice as fast as Firewire 400 why does it seem like people aren't using it?
Click to expand...

The silicon costs more and there's no advantage unless you really need to push more data. At 192 kHz/24-bit, FW400 can handle about 86 simultaneous audio channels in one direction or the other. Most interfaces aren't likely to exceed that any time soon. And since the bandwidth is reserved (isochronous transfer), it should be able to go pretty much right up to that limit without glitching.

The only reason to do FW800 in an audio interface is as a bullet point in marketing material for pass-through of a fast hard drive. Otherwise, it's basically a non-issue. That said, FW800 silicon automatically falls back to slower speeds if the silicon at the other end is slower. In fact, over specially constructed long haul links, it can even provide 100 or 200 Mbps signaling.

You can get a simple adapter or cable that connects 9-pin FW800 to 6-pin FW400 and hook up any FW400 device to a FW800 connection transparently.
 
dgatwood said:
The silicon costs more and there's no advantage unless you really need to push more data. At 192 kHz/24-bit, FW400 can handle about 86 simultaneous audio channels in one direction or the other. Most interfaces aren't likely to exceed that any time soon. And since the bandwidth is reserved (isochronous transfer), it should be able to go pretty much right up to that limit without glitching.

The only reason to do FW800 in an audio interface is as a bullet point in marketing material for pass-through of a fast hard drive. Otherwise, it's basically a non-issue. That said, FW800 silicon automatically falls back to slower speeds if the silicon at the other end is slower. In fact, over specially constructed long haul links, it can even provide 100 or 200 Mbps signaling.

You can get a simple adapter or cable that connects 9-pin FW800 to 6-pin FW400 and hook up any FW400 device to a FW800 connection transparently.
Click to expand...

Would this work?

Buy an expresscard with both Firewire 400 and Firewire 800 ports. Hook up my Firewire interface using the 400 slot. Hook up my external hard drive using the 800 slot.

expresscard: http://www.buy.com/prod/siig-firewi...-firewire-external-1/q/loc/101/202730410.html
hard drive: http://www.wdc.com/en/products/Products.asp?DriveID=322

Would I be able to use both slots on the expresscard at the same time with no issues? Is this even worth it for the extra speed, or should I just get an expresscard with two Firewire 400 ports and an external drive with Firewire 400 connectivity?

It's all more or less the same price... just trying to get the best bang for my very limited buck.
 
have heard that firewire 800 is still kinda buggy, and like has been said you're probably nor going to need that much bandwidth anyway.

usb2 can suck one.
it's neat for my flash drive and stuff, but other than that...... it can suck one.
 
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