Your input please...

sweetbeats

sweetbeats

Reel deep thoughts...
So I've always been extremely curious about a oddball in the "portastudio" world, the Akai MG series of multitrack/mixer combos. This was an integrated 12x2 mixer and 12 track analog recorder using 1/2" tape housed in a proprietary cassette shell derivative of (but not compatible with) the Sony Betamax format of video tape cassette.

Anyway, I know service, parts and support is non-existent for these machines...they are known to have transport issues. Reports on the quality of the mixer vary. But they weigh in at around 95lbs, which usually means some indication of a robust build. Anyway...I've just been damn curious about these for many years. There have been two MG-1212 units locally on Craigslist for months. I finally pulled the trigger and got the pair for $200 with one used tape. Both have transport issues, one won't play but will FFWD and REW, the other is the opposite. I feel I'm relatively resourceful with electro-mechanical stuff...I believe I can persevere and make the transports work. Curiosity just got the best of me. This isnt a "for now" project, but for later. I haven't picked them up yet.

My question is if you were me would you also pull the trigger on 10 NOS wrapped in plastic tapes for these machines for a price significantly less than what I paid for the pair of machines? These are potentially boat-anchors. I just need some feedback on this.

Here is one of the pics from the listing...

IMG_7428.JPG
 
A kid I knew in high schools dad had one of these in their basement studio. I thought it was awesome back then. 12 tracks seemed like a Paisley Park to me. They used to charge some of the local bands an hourly rate to record there (I wouldn't play ball and bought my first Porta One instead but that's another story) and the results sounded good from what I can remember. Anyways, to answer yr question about whether to buy the 10 new tapes or not, I'd wait. You have the one tape to test it and that's all you really need for now. You said yrself, this isn't even a project yr going to start right away so you'll be down that much more money. I see them come up on ebay for $20 a piece shipped all the time, and the deals on used ones are cheap as hell. Unless the deal is really good and you turn around and sell 5 to make the money back I'd let it slide.
 
Would there be any sense in saving the good tape you have and re-loading the cassette you have with video tape while working on the transport? I know video tape is thin but it may be ok. I think I read on here a while back that this machine can use Maxell EE tape, so it may even record on video tape with some bias adjustment. Sort of reverse of my using type I on the 244!
 
A machine without tape is a hefty doorstop. I think you'll have to brush up on video technology....though that's probably not true is it? The machine used a Beta video tape transport but the recording type was analogue wasn't it? So presumably all the setup is analogue, just on a very slow moving transport? Al
 
sweetbeats said:
My question is if you were me would you also pull the trigger on 10 NOS wrapped in plastic tapes for these machines for a price significantly less than what I paid for the pair of machines? These are potentially boat-anchors. I just need some feedback on this.
Click to expand...

Well...worst case...you'll have two boat anchors...and a door stop with the 10 tapes. :D

I remember seeing those MG series combos back in the day at some music stores....but I never dug deeper...mainly 'cu z I didn't like the all-in-one concept.
 
Yes it's analog...12 tracks...track width is slightly wider than a 1/4" 8-track. There are actually 14-tracks...12 audio, and one control track (for the onboard auto-locator), and a sync track for external SMPTE or MTC, though the 1212 can't chase lock...it has to be master. The successor MG-1214 I believe could chase lock.

The tape stock is presumed to be equivalent to the Maxell EE tape but some reports indicate the tape itself was manufactured by TDK. There is no definitive resource I've ever been able to find that answers all the questions about the tape stock. Did Maxell ever make their EE tape in 1/2"? I thought it was only 1/4".

I've heard of people loading the proprietary Akai MK20J tape shells with their own tape, like 456...I'm thinking the only proper tape to put in there would be LPR35.

Al, it's not a Betamax transport. Akai had a deal with Sony to use the Betamax format cassettes and had tooled up for production, but then Sony got cold feet and Akai had to come up with a proprietary design that was different enough from the Betamax format to not infringe on Sony. Shame on you, Sony. It made the Akai tapes unreasonably expensive. But the tape path is 3 stationary heads (erase, audio R/P, and control/sync R/P), not a rotating drum...the way the tape is loaded is likely similar to a Betamax machine though I'm not certain...all to be answered in due time. I'll likely look for a Betamax machine at a thrift store to dissect and compare at some point.

Anyway, I'll start with refurbishing rubber components in the tape path first since that is usually responsible for transport problems. I have a couple leads on a service manual. I did end up getting the tapes. $163.57 shipped for the 10 new-in-sealed-plastic tapes.

These things are bigger than they look in pictures...28" deep and nearly 3 feet wide.

IMG_7425.JPG
 
The other neat thing about these machines is they use Akai's GX glass head which lasts a lot longer then typical alloy heads.

I don't know...

I really don't know what I'll do with them, but I have this sick curiousity...hoe is the frame constructed? What kind of opamps are used? Are the boards phenolic or glass fiber? What is the mic pre design/from whom did they borrow the design...stuff like that.
 
sweetbeats said:
The other neat thing about these machines is they use Akai's GX glass head which lasts a lot longer then typical alloy heads.

I don't know...

I really don't know what I'll do with them, but I have this sick curiousity...hoe is the frame constructed? What kind of opamps are used? Are the boards phenolic or glass fiber? What is the mic pre design/from whom did they borrow the design...stuff like that.
Click to expand...

I nearly bought one of these a few months ago, these seem to be more common than the Tascam 388's here down under. I heard many good things about them and like you, was very curious because it seemed like a bit of a hidden gem. Everyone I heard that used one seems to have had nothing but praise regarding the sound. The big issue I heard was like you said, the transport craps out but I heard a few people that liked the pre's and EQ on this thing so much that they keep using it just as a mixer.

The one I nearly bought was setup for 456 and came with a bunch of shells but ultimately decided I was already happy with my existing setup and since I already have all the cables, mixer and recorder setup, the big bulky (and heavy) all in one wasn't really advantageous in my particular situation.

With that said, if I needed an "off-site" recording setup, for example a mate's house or a rehearsal studio to do some recording, the Akai MG1212/1214 would be super cool.

I know U2 recorded a number of tracks on the one at Sunset Sound and Billy Idol recorded an album or two of his on the Akai so the potential is definitely there.

That said though, if you are looking to fix and flip I don't think you'll get much as they aren't as highly valued as the 388 - a working one only goes for 3-400 bucks here which makes it a bargain in the analog audio market.

I was interested
 
Depending on what I find inside and what the challenge ends up being as far as the transport repairs, I wasn't thinking fix and flip.

Yeah I heard some of the material on Rattle and Hum was done on a 1212, and that Phil Collins used one for some of his releases too and had a lot of praise for it.

BIG pain in the ass would be playback level calibration. I'm sure there is a cal tape for these things at Wal Mart. :D

I would need to get a short full-track 1/2" cal tape and transfer the stock to an Akai MK20J shell.
 
I can say very little as i have limited knowledge and had less tech savvy when these came out.

However, I had a dear friend (sadly departed) who had one.

He played in Lita Ford's band and The Bangles.

This machine was his home studio recorder.

Lots of pre-production stuff was done as well as 2 of his own records..

Allegedly some stuff ended up on Bangles records.

All his mixes from the Akai were mixed down to a Sony Hi-Fi VHS machine.

Everything I'd heard sounded top notch.

Album release worthy.

Hope that's inspirational to some degree.
:D
 
sweetbeats said:
Depending on what I find inside and what the challenge ends up being as far as the transport repairs, I wasn't thinking fix and flip.

Yeah I heard some of the material on Rattle and Hum was done on a 1212, and that Phil Collins used one for some of his releases too and had a lot of praise for it.

BIG pain in the ass would be playback level calibration. I'm sure there is a cal tape for these things at Wal Mart. :D

I would need to get a short full-track 1/2" cal tape and transfer the stock to an Akai MK20J shell.
Click to expand...

Had no idea about that Rattle and Hum fact! Now that's cool!

And apparently it's true. You can see the machine in a museum case with a note detailing its use on that album.

Sun Studio, U2, and the Evolution of Recording Technology

Very cool!
 
famous beagle said:
Had no idea about that Rattle and Hum fact! Now that's cool!

And apparently it's true. You can see the machine in a museum case with a note detailing its use on that album.

Sun Studio, U2, and the Evolution of Recording Technology

Very cool!
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Oh that's very cool...thanks for posting that link! Now, that's the second generation MG 1214. It's very, very similar to the MG 1212s I'll be picking up, but my understanding is it had chase-lock capability, and a revised lower-noise mic preamp. But the article you linked is fun...it specifies songs on which the Akai was used to track and just from the song titles I can hear the songs...I have Rattle and Hum on vinyl...huge U2 fan. I think October is my favorite album though. Anyway...

And here is a recent interview of Phil Collins by Digital Trends where the "Akai 12-track" is highlighted...near the end of the interview when discussing the Both Sides album...it doesn't specify if it was the MG 1212 or MG 1214, nor does Phil Collins comment on the sound or operation of the unit, but it's pretty clear tracks from the Akai are used in the final production:

Interview: Phil Collins on Both Sides, Face Value remasters | Digital Trends
 
Ah man, I emailed a guy I knew who told me he was selling one of these with some tapes last month or so. He still had the tapes too, 5 NOS and 2 used ones for $50. Oh well. I had a feeling I was gonna come back on here and you would have already bought em.
 
Level Anything said:
Ah man, I emailed a guy I knew who told me he was selling one of these with some tapes last month or so. He still had the tapes too, 5 NOS and 2 used ones for $50. Oh well. I had a feeling I was gonna come back on here and you would have already bought em.
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So, wait...you know a guy that is selling 5 NOS and two used MK20J tapes for $50?
 
Buy the tapes Sweetbeats, I'm sure that they'll add to the resell value of the machine...IF you can get it working, hmmm?
 
Hammerstone said:
Buy the tapes Sweetbeats, I'm sure that they'll add to the resell value of the machine...IF you can get it working, hmmm?
Click to expand...

You talking about the 10 NOS tapes I was asking about in the first post? It's buried in the thread but I did end up getting them...$163.57 including shipping. :guitar:
 
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