Mixing a Strumming Guitar Analog

bachelorb

Cowboy Chord Virtuoso
(actually...... I can't do it in a DAW either.....)

I am having the hardest time getting the guitar to sound in the mixer how it sounds to my ( or my wife's ) ear. On the tape it sounds thin and it seems like I can almost hear every note. I'm also hearing a lot of bass that I don't hear with my ear. I'd like to muddy it up a bit. any suggestions????

....oh yeah.... here's what I've got:

My mixer has this for an eq.

File Feb 02, 6 47 07 PM.png

(sorry for the pic, but I didn't want to mistype any of the "semi-quasi" stuff..... :D )

My huge arsenal of effects is listed below:

Alesis Nanoverb
DBX Compressor/Limiter
Delay Pedal

....yep.....thats it.......

Thanks for any and all suggestions or tips..... I'd appreciate just throwing some out and I'll try em....

Thanks again,

Brad
 
How is the guitar interfaced with the mixer and tape machine? DI? Mic?

---------- Update ----------

What kind of guitar?
 
+1.
If you're DIing it's going to sound very different to how it sounds acoustically.

If you're micing, try moving them back to get the sound of the room more.
If your mics are closer than your ears generally are then they are picking up more reflections which may, or may not be flattering.
 
Yes.... I am DI’ing and mic’ing.... the mic is really close, so I’ll try moving it back.... I’ve also heard multiple mics are good?

All I really want it to do is sound natural..... (now..... can you guess my quantitative version of natural?) :D

For some reason, mine just doesn’t sound that way......
 
The closer you mic the less you hear the room and the more you're hearing a specific area of the instrument.
A mic close to the soundhole will sound boomy whereas a mic at the nut or saddle is probably going to sound much thinner and more metallic.

A microphone ten feet away is going to capture the instrument as it sounds to you, perfectly balanced, but, of course, it'll sound like it's ten feet away too. :p

With stereo mics I generally aim for approx 12th and just past the saddle in the other direction.
I usually try to be 18"-2' away with the mics so I'm not too focussed on an area of the instrument.
There's a million ways to skin that cat, though, so experiment. ;)

Stereo image would certainly help with making it sound more natural; Maybe give the above a go?

I just fitted a new bridge and did a neck reset on my new (old) guitar.
I'll have to throw up the mics and christen it soon. :)
 
I have got the pressure cooker ready and as soon as I am brave enough , I have two necks to reset...... let me know how yours go........
 
Lets figure out how to record it properly before we start tearing the damn things apart lol:D
 
Yeah...the best thing for a natural acoustic guitar sound, is to capture it as naturally as you can in the room.

I would put up as couple of mics for a nice stereo spread, one maybe about 12" from the sound hole...up above it a bit, and then angled down some.
It's best if you set up the mic, and then play with the headphones on while you slowly turn your body/guitar and move a bit in/out...and listen for where it sounds best, and then hold that position as best as you can when playing. Try to get some of the beefiness there.

Then the other mic maybe higher up the neck, also about 12" or so away....or you can try it even a couple of feet back, if you are in a nice warm, live room...that way it can pick up all the reflections and give it some sparkle.

Work with that and do a few test passes making mic adjustments and find the combination that best gets you how you're hearing it.

You can still include the DI, and keep it flat and dry...so you can bring that into the mix just a little to bring the sound forward. You pan the two mic L/R to taste, and set the DI track dead center, and bring up the level to where it's helping the mic tracks without making the combined mix sound "in you face"...because you will get most of the natural sound from the two mics.

That's about all I got from my own acoustic guitar recordings...but then, I don't do a all that much solo acoustic guitar kind of stuff. I mostly use acoustic guitar tracks to fill out the rhythm with the electric guitars...and not to be the backbone of a mix.
 
If you want it to sound natural, don't bother with the di. That will never sound natural.
 
Sometimes with a dynamic mic and an acoustic guitar you can get a really full sound placing the mic close to the sound hole due to the proximity effect. If you don’t know what that is, Google it. It can be a useful tool in mic placement. But also keep in mind low frequencies need some space to develop...I like using a couple LDCs in M+S configuration anywhere from 3’ to 6’ away. Or a single condenser 1-2’ away and experiment with pointing it anywhere between the sound hole and the 12th fret. Experiment. But don’t be afraid to give it some room. Find out where it sounds good to one ear. Plug one ear and point the other to the guitar and move around...find where the sound has the richness of the instrument and balance of the room sound and put the mic there.
 
Also if you are trying to mix two tracks from the same performance whether it is mic'd or di'd you run the risk of phase cancellation (not just "flipped 180" but differing enough) causing the combined output to sound strange. Which is great when you do it on purpose as an effect, not so much when you are trying for natural.
 
Talk about tippy toeing through a mine field:)

OK, ignoring the acoustic environment you're recording in, let's start with the sound source........each guitar has it's own characteristics, ie: brightness and/or fullness of sound, etc.,etc., the age of the strings and the way it's played.

How YOU can best capture the sound first starts with a real understanding of what I said in the previous paragraph, then telling us what mics you have available and until we know that, it's impossible to give much useful advice that specifically applies to your situation.

Prior to tracking, particularly with acoustic guitar or drums, I'll move around listening, if necessary being down on my hands and knees to find that sweet spot and then if necessary, try different mics out based on what I've heard.

There's been some good general advice given by others but give us more detail on your gear etc., and more helpful advice may be forthcoming.

:)
 
Thanks guys for all the help. I'm going to be trying out the suggestions and should have some pics and sound bites up this afternoon. A couple of things I am going to try right off the bat is the stereo mic'ing (maybe even three....) That may do what I need. I'm also going to try the different positions with different mics etc..... I worry that standing the mic off will get a lot of room noise, but I'm going to try that too.

How YOU can best capture the sound first starts with a real understanding of what I said in the previous paragraph, then telling us what mics you have available and until we know that, it's impossible to give much useful advice that specifically applies to your situation.


I have 3 Mics:

a SM57 clone (.....thats right..... I'm a Nady daddy.... :) )
a EV RE50 clone (Realistic 33-1070)
and a MXL 910 condenser

Lets figure out how to record it properly before we start tearing the damn things apart lol
.... :D I belly laughed at that one.......
 
Well, I'm going to suggest you try working a single mic until you've figured out the best placement. The MXL should be capable of capturing the guitar quite well. Multiple mics come with their own issues, and you might end up battling those before you've worked out or understood the room vs guitar and angle issues.

Try the MXL directly out from the neck joint (12th or 14th fret) at least 8" and move out from there. Aim it slightly toward the end of the fingerboard. Play with distance and angle first. Then listen for room noises, your own foot shuffling, chair creaking, huffing and snorting, whatever. Try to tame those, and maybe work the vertical angle of the mic at that point, e.g., raise it and aim down if you're' a heavy breather, lower and aim up if you can't keep your feet still, etc. Move around 360º to get the back of the mic facing the worst external noise (room window, computer fans, etc.). IOW/IMO/IME, there are so many things you should do with a single mic before embarking on multiple mics, especially if the guitar and room are Ok to begin with.

Of course, for solo guitar work, you probably should be thinking more than one mic, but to beat the horse once more, not where I'd start.

And keep it just to mic to recording equipment with no pedals or other stuff.
 
I just realized I may have forgot to mention the elephant in the room........

File Dec 19, 2 50 18 PM.jpeg

What I call a guitar, may not be a guitar..... This is a four stringed instrument( essentially) six strings, but tuned Dd-Gg-B-E .

Maybe what I ought to be asking is how to get a fuller strumming sound out of a baritone ukulele.....
 
The same mixing principals will work on all strained acoustic instruments, including standard ukes, upright basses, cellos, etc...
 
I just realized I may have forgot to mention the elephant in the room.

If the fundamental issue is that the instrument sounds good in the room but the recording doesn't reflect that, then all the same advice still applies. :)

If it doesn't sound good in the room, that's a different matter!

Either way, losing the DI is probably a healthy first step. In my experience DI acoustic instruments have a unique sound, generally not natural.
Often brittle, metallic, thin etc.
DI acoustic guitar usually immediately reminds me of almost every pub gig I've ever been to! :p


Sometimes useful but, for me, never on a main part in a recording.

Sometimes I'll add DI tracks (separate recordings) along with mic tracks if I want to beef up the rhythm sound, in a more dense mix where acoustic guitar is the main drive, without two sets competing or getting muddy.
DI sustain is usually shorter sounding and the whole thing usually much more percussive.

All generalisations but hopefully useful. :)
 
Recording Acoustic Guitar |

Also, someone once said "To make a great guitar recording, start with a great guitar then a great room then a great........" I would not be so impolite as to complete the quote!

Oh, BTW, just insert 'Mixer' for 'Interface'.

Dave.
 
The same mixing principals will work on all strained acoustic instruments...

I know it's a typo, and you mean "stringed"...but I love the unintentional meaning.

Those poor instruments, and all that pressure to perform well... :p
 
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