Need preamp/interface for SM7b

joms

New member
I understand that this has been asked a lot (i've just starting reading some threads) but my needs are a bit different in some aspect.

I intend to use my setup for vocal recordings only. I won't use this mic for guitar/drums/keyboards/etc. It will only stay in my house (room or living room which both are untreated). I initially started out this venture when during our karaoke parties with my friends, I said to myself, i want something better than the stock karaoke player with the stock mic. So I bought a shure SM58 to upgrade the mic. When I plugged it in the karaoke player, the mic volume was really low (at first I thought it was not working right). So I got a mixer (allen & heath Zed-10) then a QSC K10, etc. I was satisfied now with the quality during our karaoke nights with my friends.

Now I want to start recording my voice to my computer (PC and MBP). I live in the Philippines so choices here are not that easy to come by. I had a good fortune, thought, to be able to test a Shure SM7b from someone selling it since his preamp couldn't power the mic. I tried it on my Allen&Heath but when i turned up the gain, it got really really noisy. Despite this noise, I was still amazed with the quality sound the mic showed me (although only at a low volume and low gain).

I told myself that I want that mic! It suited my voice so much.

In this regard, I need your help to suggest/recommend a preamp and an interface for the Shure SM7b to be able to get my voice to my computer.

If possible, I would like to get a preamp and an interface for $700 (total price for both preamp and interface)

I'm looking right now at the Focusrite ISA One (around $400 bnew). Ive read that Grace 101 is also very nice but the price is just too much.


Some other questions:

1) Is there a good clean preamp with 60+ gain that also has echo/reverb (because I might want to use the SM7b sometimes during our karaoke session with my friends in the living room and it is nice to have some echo rather than a flat sounding voice only)

2) Is it a must to get an interface with a firewire like what the seller of the SM7b told me? He said that USB is dirty and I will be recording lots of ticks my computer makes if I go the USB route.
I do prefer USB though since I will be able to record on several computers. If I use firewire, I will restrict myself to my desktop only. However, if firewire is really that much better/cleaner than USB then firewire it is.

3) Is it safe to buy used preamp/interface in ebay? How would I know that the item im buying doesn't have a whine or something? My friend said that I can buy used for preamps/interface but I should always buy bnew for mic.

Thank you very much for your help.

PS: I am very new to this and I have never connected a preamp with an interface going to a computer or such so much help is really needed. I cannot audition any mic/preamp/interface as they are not available at all here in the Philippines and even if they are, they won't allow us to audtition it so I have to rely 100% on your recommendations. I have a decent i5 16GB ram resktop computer and a MBP 13". Software is no problem here.
 
USB isnt noisy or dirty. It helps to shutdown all applications and internet and wi-fi when recording so the CPU can focus on the audio. Turn off all the software you can when recording and your "clicks" will often disappear.

The preamp..for SM7 is one thing, and to have the ability of reverb abnd effects too sounds like a Digitech Mic Processor is more what youre looking for. These arent known for super-hi end preamps, but for kareoke youll be ok.

I dont care for Ebay at all. Some ripoff and bad exp....as a buyer its been better than being a seller. But stores offer returns, and Craigslist theres no shipping and FleaBay charges and hassles, so savings is greater and deals smoother, ymmv.

ISA ONE is a really good choice.... good gain match and pro-level setup.
 
Hi there.
I think those kinds of problems aren't exclusive to USB. You can have that sort of thing going on with any technology.
USB is more commonly used though (printer, mouse, keyboard, webcam, bluetooth etc) so maybe that contributes to people having issues.


Anyway, you want a computer based recording setup, but also a good quality line level signal to send to your karaoke machine?

Maybe take a look at some of the all-in-one interfaces? They have preamps built in.

For recording you just plug the mic in and for karaoke you take a line out from it to your karaoke machine.
Down side is you'd always have to have your recording software open for karaoke, but you'd have access to almost limitless effects like compressors, limiters, eqs, reverbs etc.

Alternatively you could just do what you're doing for karaoke, and pick up an all-in-one interface just for recording.

I use a presonus firestudio mobile with an sm7b and it works beautifully.
That's firewire but it's just one example.
Just keep an eye on the gain figures. I don't think presonus USB offerings have the same gain.
 
Good advice.
If you still have that 58 you could reserve it for Karaoke.

The 'two separate setups' idea is really starting to make sense to me.
 
Thanks for the reply.

Is the TC Helicon better than the effects on my Allen & Heath ZED-10 mixer? I actually don't know how to setup the Allen&Heath mixer to make our karaoke sound the best it can be. If I get the TC Helicon, how do I connect it to my Zed-10 mixer? Can it only accomodate 1 mic?

Thanks
 
Hi Joms.
I think you have a problem. I have a ZED10 and using an SM57 I can get very low noise recordings. I have just run the zed into my 2496: Gain max, channel and mix out at "0". Panned centre.
Result is a noise floor of -72dB FS rms and that is spoiled a bit by a b'std 50Hz hum peak of 12dB above noise on the right hand channel. That is not due to the mixer, I must check my setup. Also the mic input was open circuit I would expect some improvement with a 150R load. When I record quiet acoustic guitar with a 57 my problem is getting the room quiet enough, NOT system noise.

Now I do understand that the SM7b is some 4-6dB less sensitive than a 57 (depends who you ask!) but even so, unless you are recording too hot the SM7 should be ok with the A&H mixer IMHO. It is also worth pointing out that the mic is designed for really close speech.

But if you really do feel the need for a low noise booster can I suggest you look at the Cloud Lifter?

Dave.
 
Hmmm I see. I tested the mic with the Allen & Heath and there was system noise when I turned the knob past the 50db+ mark.

I'm actually fixing the A&H mixer to my karaoke system. I need a completely new preamp for my room where my computer is (this is where I will do my computer recording). I won't use the A&H mixer when recording to my computer.

During our karaoke sessions, I will sometimes bring out my SM7b along with its preamp and just plug it in my A&H mixer. (is this possible? mic-->preamp--->A&H mixer)
 
Hmmm I see. I tested the mic with the Allen & Heath and there was system noise when I turned the knob past the 50db+ mark.

I'm actually fixing the A&H mixer to my karaoke system. I need a completely new preamp for my room where my computer is (this is where I will do my computer recording). I won't use the A&H mixer when recording to my computer.

During our karaoke sessions, I will sometimes bring out my SM7b along with its preamp and just plug it in my A&H mixer. (is this possible? mic-->preamp--->A&H mixer)

Yes, there will be some noise from the mixer pre amps. The test is, when in use and averaging ~-18dBFS in the DAW meters, what is the noise floor when you stop waffling?

Yes, a mic pre amp can be plugged into any of the ZED's line inputs.

FYI. My NI Ka6 has a better noise floor than my 2496 soundcard (considering the years in between one would expect so!) 2496 is -96dBFS and the NI (gains min) -100dBFS. Plug a 57 into the NI and I need the mic gains at max for ac'guitar but again I get a noise floor around -73dB much of which is the room even at 2 am in a leafy suburb (Goog E, nn5 5p*).

And from the reviews I have read of the Cloud Lifter you will not get a lower noise 25dB boost from anything else at the price of about US$100.

Dave.
 
I love the older Joemeek preamps/recording channels and have a small collection. I don't have an SM7b, but I know from reading that they are gain hungry. I use a ribbon mic and even the little VC3s have no shortage of gain for it. The VC1 and VC2 even more so. The older JM pres are relatively inexpensive used, too.
 
I've got a crappy little Behringer mixer I just plugged my SM7b into. Brought the gain up and got noise, but........ most of the noise was background room noise. Are you possibly mistaking ambient room noise to be noise you think may be introduced by the mic and/or mixer?

Right! ^ It is very easy and cheap these days to make very low noise microphone amplifiers. The failing of many of the cheap mixers is in fact headroom but since most soundcards only need a volt or so for 0dBFS even this is not really a problem.
I repeat, set the system up to get average levels of -18dBFS remembering that this is a close up mic, then shut TFUp and see the noise level.. Then unplug the mic and check levels again. If meter resolution is a problem download Samplitude Silver or Sony Soundforge, both have a 90dB meter range.

Dave.
 
Hmmmm the room was rather noisy but it seems that its not room noise as the type of noise ive heard is like a hiss i hear in old TVs when theres no channel.

Anyway with or without hiss on my allen & heath, I still need a preamp since I will be using the A&H on my living room while I will be using the Sm7b mainly on my bedroom where my desktop is. =)

For now I am geared on getting the Focusrite ISA One. (Analog only). Im looking now for a USB interface (with no preamp since I wont really be using its preamp because I already have an ISA One. Or if theres no such interface then I just need a good clean and reliable interface that will hook my ISA One to my Computer. Preferable USB3)
 
Joms, AFAIKS in the case of interfaces without mic amps there seems to be a gaping hole in the market. You can get cheapish, ESI do a couple and really cheap, Bellringer UCA 202. Or very expensive, Benchmark. lavrey etc...There seems to be nothing inbetween?

I shall make no apology therefore for once again suggesting the NI KA6 interface. It has the dedicated line ins you need and all the sources that I can find say it is the best AI sub £400 about at the moment.

Usb 3 AIs? Don't get me started on.....! I have asked about and for some reason people seem to dismiss the subject saying there is no need. Well I disagree. I think Firewire is doomed and Thunderbolt will (as FW was) only be fitted to top range machines. Usb3 holds the promise of FW400 bandwidths but hopefully without the chipset debacle. Then usb3 delivers more DC power and thus makes more complex bus powered devices possible, might even get a usb AI with a really kick ass headphone amp!

Dave.
 
ecc83 - Thanks for the reply. I looked into the KA6 and the price and features is pretty nice. This will work with my focusrite ISA one right? So I would connect the XLR out (mono) of the ISA One and insert the other end to the mic XLR Input of the KA6 ? Then I will plug a USB cable in the KA6 to my computer. Is this right? How do I bypass the preamp section of the KA6 so that only the preamp of my focusrite will work?

Thanks
 
ecc83 - Thanks for the reply. I looked into the KA6 and the price and features is pretty nice. This will work with my focusrite ISA one right? So I would connect the XLR out (mono) of the ISA One and insert the other end to the mic XLR Input of the KA6 ? Then I will plug a USB cable in the KA6 to my computer. Is this right? How do I bypass the preamp section of the KA6 so that only the preamp of my focusrite will work?

Thanks
Not quite J. The ISA 1 would feed the line inputs 3 and 4 which (I think one can reasonably assume) have a direct and minimal path to the converters, no padded mic chips in the way!

One slight possible wrinkle. The KA6 gives 0dBFS for a line 3/4 input of +12dBu (~3V rms). The ISA being a "pro" pre amp will certainly be capable of more than this and although I am sure you would be able to use the two devices as they are, I would probably make up a pair of simple resistive attenuators to get the gain staging spot on.

To defend the KA6, you would not get pro op level line inputs on anything but a very expensive converter anyway and +12dBu is higher than most.

I will check the ISA One spec for thee!

Dave.
 
Hi Dave,

Thanks so much for the post but I got lost at "KA6 gives 0dBFS ...... etc" LOL. Sorry for being such a noob.

By the way, I am also buying a bnew computer. Does the KA6 need special specs like it only responds good with xxx chipset and such? (Ive read that firewire cards are picky. I hope this being USB wont be that picky).

Ive also been reading around and some suggests the ff:

Focusrite scarlett
Roland Quadcapture
maudio profire 610

Are these any good? How do they stack up against the KA6? I should only be concerned with the AD conversion of the interface right? since the preamp would be done solely by the ISA one.

Thanks again Dave. Im not having luck and it is sure nice to get some help from you.

PS - ISA One has only 1 output but I should connect it to KA6's channel 3 and 4? (2 inputs)? How do I do this?
 
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The KA6 has switchable-able Mic/Line XLR inputs 1 and 2 on the front of the unit. I'm not sure why these couldn't be used rather than the 1/4" Inputs 3/4 on the rear of the KA6. It would be easier to find an XLR to XLR cable to connect this way.
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They could, but I think we're trying to avoid series mic pres, or unnecessary pads.
 
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