Looking for a "colored" preamp, hard to explain in a title, expained in post

Robert D said:
Excellent suggestion, though it's kind of absurd to have to take a hardware approach to this problem.

Talon - You can't host any plugins???? Man, time to change programs!
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Well, i can, just not in the program i'm using which is Reason 4.0. I can rewire in to Protools and use RTAS plugins, or buy a vst wrapper. Or i can load a wave file in acid. I HATE rewire though, except for mixing. I'd much rather not be able to use plug ins and use reason than to not be able to use reason (or have to use it though rewire) and be able to use plug ins.
 
talontsiawd said:
EDIT- Is there anything out there for around $100 that i could make that is basically a complete kit? I'm handy with a soldering iron but i'm no electition so i defineatly need directions and parts.
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The PRR Vari-Mu is probably exactly what you want and can be done for $100 if you can scavenge a box for it. I don't think there was a PCB group buy, I could be wrong but I think you'd have to etch it yourself:

http://www.diyfactory.com/projects/diy12au7comp/diy12au7comp.htm
 
...

Scream, when used right, can do what you want perfectly.

Alot of us use it to add that "old school" sound to match old albums. It also doesn't hurt to notch out some of the freq above 8k-10k...
 
Thanks again for everyones oppinion. I do have to say, please don't leave strong oppinions on "what not to do". First, i can figure that out myself. Second, i have achieved this in was that people told me after the fact, without knowing that i found it to work well, that i was totally off on how i'm trying to achieve something. I can do what i need to do, i'm just looking for a quicker way to do it.
 
A bit of a tangent here, but I'm wondering if you might could use a better phono-preamp? Not to start a flashfire, but, in general, records from the 60's and 70's shouldn't sound grainy or muddy. I have literally thousands of them and fairly often they offer better sound than CD reissues of them. And I absolutely have at the very least, hundreds of them that are about as good as it gets.
So I'm thinking possibly there's something you could do to improve what you're getting off those records.
Otherwise ..... everyone has given you some good ideas. I think maybe a tubed buffer of some kind. A tubed comp would fill the bill but possibly anything that would 'tube-up' the sound some might work.
 
My records sound fine. My goal is to find something easy to make my digital sounds mesh better with stuff i sample. Anyway, i think i have more than enough ideas now:)
 
I have to admit the Lt. is right.
I have some scuzzy records that are the result of poor use/misuse/party fav needle drops etc, bad pressing, and occassionally poor mastering but BY & LARGE they sound good. The 80's LP sometimes weren't so good but that's more to do with 80's production techniques.
My collection of 1300+ is mainly 70s+ and generally they sound better than the mismastered original CD release AND the REMASTERED CD release. Sometimes the REMASTER CD misses the point & they go beyond dealing with the obvious EQ issue related to vinyl master/stamper/pressing stuff and they FIDDLE.
 
Again, what i'm trying to do has nothing to do with anything on vinyl. It has to do with the digital sounds i sometimes use in Reason. I'm trying to do my best to make both "mesh" better interms of sound.
 
look ..... you asked the question so people are giving you responses ...... use what seems useful and don't use the rest.
And you yourself said you needed it to be grainy and muddy so it'd mesh with vinyl and all I was pointing out was that vinyl shouldn't be grainy and muddy so the idea was that you could also make things mesh with the vinyl sound by improving it to where it should be.
it's a valid response and a valid suggestion and an absolutely valid alternative way to achieve what you were asking.
If you don't want to go that way then don't but I don't see a need for you to complain that some answers aren't what you want to hear.
just pick thru the suggestions and use the ones you like and ignore the rest.
That's how it works in virtually every other thread where someone asks for ideas.
 
Understood. I don't see any instance where i was complaining. I wanted to clarify that point because i thought you missunderstood, now i see what you mean. I apprciate the suggestion, and actually, i've found cartriges to be what really improves soundquality (if you are using any decent preamp), but it still sounds nothing like digital, hence the original question. Again, i appciate it, i just thought you didn't understand what i was asking.
 
Just throwing in my .02. If you like the sound of the tape deck thing (which IMO is the closest thing to vinyl in terms of "lo-fi" shaping), then stick with that. BUT, find a good deck like a Nakamichi or a Revox (can be had on ebay for cheap) that has two things:

1) 3-Head design (enables monitoring off the playback head in record mode)
2) Adjustable record bias control.

What this will allow you to do is to send the signal out of your PC, into the tape deck, and back to the PC while the deck is in record mode. The signal will hit the tape, immediately be played back (with a short delay) and sent back to your PC for processing. The adjustable bias will allow you to control the "color" of the signal in real time as you play the source back. You adjust the bias while in record, and immediately hear the result printed to tape while monitoring. Not to mention the type of tape in conjunction with the bias adjustment will give you a wide pallette of different tones to choose from.

So now you have two options. Either print your signal through the tape deck to track, then nudge the track to compensate for the delay. OR, nudge the track thats going to tape backwards while listening in record-monitor to get the timing right. So alls you do is keep the tape running and youve got a continuously adjustable "bias-box" that will flavor the audio to your likings.

If you really want to get crazy (or if your ALL sequencer based), setup delay compensation in Reason to delay the playback of everything versus the signal your "processing". So now you've got PSP VintageWarmer on STEROIDS HAHA.

Too confusing or involved?

The ART TPS dual-channel preamp is your ticket. The V3 (Variable Valve Voicing) technology in that thing lets you choose what type of "dirty" you want and will deffinately give you the saturation you're looking for. You can actually (if you're careful) get really tasty, usable "clean" sounds out of that box. A better power supply with that unit really helps for this.

Anyway hopefully I didn't lose you.

Help much?

Holla

~the kid

BTW, at about $200 on the used market the TPS box is not a bad paintbrush to have around, ya dig?
 
P.S. Not to start shit, but unless I stand corrected the "muddy" thing is what he's going for. Lo-fi is pretty hip if it's done right.
 
Damn, ok, you might have sold me on the last one. I actually loved using my tape deck, it worked the best. But after hitting record, rewinding, etc, it ended up being easier to just use an amp and a mic, as long as it was set up.

So if i can just have it record back in, that's perfect. That's why i was thinking a preamp or compressor, simple in and out. I got the best results with a tape recorder but after mine broke (it was OLD), i found it was easier to have something that was faster.

The delay isn't a problem, i just record loops and then chop the audio back into a loop.

I think we have a winner.
 
Hahaha sweeeet.

Yeah I actually run mixdowns through my Otari MX-5050 1/4" tape deck like i described to warm em up. Mastering to 1/4" or 1/2" tape sounds fucking awesome, but tape degrades. Plus I like being able to adjust the bias of the tape in real time like you would tweak a verb unit or something just so I can dial in exactly what edge I want to the analog crunchyness.

So you never really have to "master or track to tape". I say "master THROUGH tape" and then to a DAT or CD deck. Also, by recording THROUGH the tape deck instead of TO and FROM it, you avoid the risk of wow and flutter from the winding of the tape on the reels. As long as you use fresh tape, you never actually "hear" the tape. You just hear what the tape does to the sound.

Tape-fat in real time rules lol.

Glad I could help dude.
 
I was always under the impression that if the tape reel is not spinning, then you are not running it through the tape, but merely getting a copy of the signal looped through internally. Once you actually start the transport the monitoring shifts to the actual repro head which means you are hearing the tape, and not just the I/O section.
 
talontsiawd said:
I'll look into those. I really really don't like plug ins outside of eq's and digital delay as well as the program i use doesn't allow for vst's or any 3rd party plug ins. So being able to record a loop and just load it back in is easier, that's why i'm more interested in finding a hardware piece, assumeing it will work. And, as i stated above, hardware has had the best results in the past, it just hasn't been all the convient.
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never mind...I missed...deleted:D
 
Forget the convoluted signal chain. You should be able to find a way to do what you want to without leaving the computer. Find digital sounds that come ready-made the way you want them, or use a digital filter of some sort on the ones you have, whatever.
 
xstatic said:
I was always under the impression that if the tape reel is not spinning, then you are not running it through the tape, but merely getting a copy of the signal looped through internally. Once you actually start the transport the monitoring shifts to the actual repro head which means you are hearing the tape, and not just the I/O section.
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I think he's recording to tape... and pulling the signal from the play head... as it's recording, thinking that no wow or flutter is involved in the original pass...
 
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