Dohh! Yeah, if you run across a used Tampa during the course of your search and can snag it for under $300, then that's a good intermediate pre with a nice compressor and DIO. I like mine a lot. $400 is a kind of a hard place to be, because your just short of where some pretty high end sounding units are, like the Grace, the P-Solo,....etc.
I hate to do it but: a good pre in the 0-$400 range :o
- Thread starter Nick The Man
- Start date
Dohh! Yeah, if you run across a used Tampa during the course of your search and can snag it for under $300, then that's a good intermediate pre with a nice compressor and DIO. I like mine a lot. $400 is a kind of a hard place to be, because your just short of where some pretty high end sounding units are, like the Grace, the P-Solo,....etc.
kharendotca
New member
I bought a focusrite platinum vocal master and it is without a doubt the best pre-amp/optical compressor/tube simulator/ etc for the money I have ever used and I have tried alot!!!!
Costs about 649 Canadian
Please visit kharen.ca
Costs about 649 Canadian
Please visit kharen.ca
warlock110
New member
the MPA gold is rare to find cheap, new or used, it's pretty much the going price in the market, new ones are 270-300 and used one are just slightly less (like 240-260). It all depends on the buyer, some of them are pretty dumb and actually buy used one for more than new, but that's because they don't know the price and just bet away on ebay. Other wise 270 shipped new is the loweset i've found when i search for mine. I got a used one from MF for 195, but there was only 1 left.
warlock110
New member
yep, same one the DMPA has digital out and converters onboard.
Nick The Man
New member
Thank you, this is what I was wondering.
Anyways, I do plan on getting an MPA just not the DMPA.
First, I plan on getting a TAMPA, then deciding wheater or not to buy the MPA. How do you think these two compare?
warlock110
New member
i don't know, the tampa is just slightly more expensive than the MPA + new tubes. I've never used the Tampa, but it should be pretty dam good, it's got compressor and EQ on there, EQ is probably not gonna be use often, but the compressor should help you with tracking alot.
I've never used the Tampa, but i've had the DMP3, if it's similar then it's decent. The mpa gold i have and i'm using it right now, new tubes deffinitely improve the quality, i took out the cheap chinese tubes and put in some ok tubes (tung-sol and Mullard). If you buy it, get ready to swap the tubes, cost about 50 for 2 (cheap ones), NOS tubes are much more.
I'm not gonna recommend anything because i've not use both, can't really compare. Just go with what you need, if you don't need EQ + compressor, i don't really see why go with the tampa.
Someone recommend the RNP, it's around 475 and people seems to like it, i never have it, but i'm very suspicious about how "good" people claim it to be.
NL5
Unpossible!
This from a guy who puts Mullards into a starved plate "tube" preamp. Those poor Mullards!
The RNP is the only "budget" pre that can hang with the big boys. Beats the crap out of an ART "tube" pre.
Best deal on a ACTUAL TUBE pre. Find a used VMP-2 by AMR/Peavey - That's a TUBE pre.
That's a pretty strong, opinion. I have compared the DMP3 against a $600 Meek VC1Q and a $1,400 Sebatron vmp1000, and on one application--solo acoustic guit--the DMP3 beats them both. It is also a very decent vocal pre and I suspect excels in other clean preamp applications. I have not heard the RNP in person, but from the clips I'v heard, it certainly doesn't DESTROY the DMP3--except maybe as a bass DI.
...oh, and the best deal on a real tube pre IMO is the Sebatron. They are amazingly versatile--just not my fave on solo acoustic guit.
warlock110
New member
This from a guy who puts Mullards into a starved plate "tube" preamp. Those poor Mullards!
The RNP is the only "budget" pre that can hang with the big boys. Beats the crap out of an ART "tube" pre.
Best deal on a ACTUAL TUBE pre. Find a used VMP-2 by AMR/Peavey - That's a TUBE pre.
I'm not trying to be rude so bare with me here, the reason i didn't "recommend" anything is because I don't know them all well enough, i know their components from other people telling me and their functions. And it would be nice if you can give people correct information instead of jumping on "the guy with starved plate MPA gold"
https://homerecording.com/bbs/showpost.php?p=2327581&postcount=27
also post 28 on the same thread will tell you how "starved plate" the mpa gold is
https://homerecording.com/bbs/showpost.php?p=1826636&postcount=3
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jul04/articles/artdigital.htm
http://forum.cakewalk.com/tm.asp?m=844405#
http://www.gearslutz.com/board/1527039-post25.html
Oh, and just for kicks, here's a comparision of DMP3 and RNP on acustic guitar
https://homerecording.com/bbs/showthread.php?t=231789
Now it's my turn to ask you about the RNP, it's a solid state design using wall wart, the amp uses blurbrown chips, no transformer, costs 475 new
The DMP3 is a solid state design using wall wart, the amp uses blurbrown chips, no transformer, costs 150 new
The MS1b is a solid state design using some weird ass power cable, the amp uses blurbrown chips, no transformer, costs 150 new
I'm not saying that it's comparable, but dam, that's some similar components right there and i don't know why the RNP costs 325 more than the other 2, is the OPAMP on there like 100 times more expensive even though they're all blurbrown chips?
The MPA gold is a multi gain amp, it goes solid state using OPA2134 (blurbrown), and then through the tube full votage, why do people know it's full votage? the unit needs 300V to operate, n u take out the tube = no sound. The tube is full votage through the signal chain. Does it cost the 300 bucks it charges to make? like most audio gear, i don't think so, but it does gives quite a few more extra options such as high pass filter, DI, variable impedence, output gain, input gain, and the tube (compare to the DMP3 for 150). I got mine for 200, and i think it's worth it.
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NL5
Unpossible!
First off, I still don't think the ART is a full tube preamp. I have never heard of a true tube amp anywhere near that cheap new or one with a Tube warmth LED meter.......
As for the component comparison, there is more to it than that. I'm not gonna waste time explaining all that - just use the search function.
Lastly, the listening test you provided was with $10 mics. So, I guess if you are gonna plug a $10 mic into the pre, then heck, I wouldn't even waste my money on a DMP3.
I have used nearly all of the pre's mentioned, and then some. A lot more in fact. I am not a believer in all the preamp hype. Not by any stretch. In the grand scheme of things, they are not nearly as important as they are made out to be on internet forums. However, better pre's do help. Especially if you have good mics, converters, and a good room (as well a good source). IMHO the RNP beat out every cheap pre I have ever heard. It wasn't until a got a MUCH more expensive "clean" pre that I sold it. It isn't perfect, but if you can't make a great recording with it, you are doing something wrong. Not everybody needs a pre as good as the RNP. Most on this site wouldn't probably even hear the difference thru their crappy converters in an untreated room after they had their guitar amp cranked to 11 for the past three hours. This makes "upgrading" to an ART pre even that much more pointless though.
Nick's work is ready for a better pre if you ask me.............
warlock110
New member
First off, I still don't think the ART is a full tube preamp. I have never heard of a true tube amp anywhere near that cheap new or one with a Tube warmth LED meter.......
As for the component comparison, there is more to it than that. I'm not gonna waste time explaining all that - just use the search function.
Lastly, the listening test you provided was with $10 mics. So, I guess if you are gonna plug a $10 mic into the pre, then heck, I wouldn't even waste my money on a DMP3.
I have used nearly all of the pre's mentioned, and then some. A lot more in fact. I am not a believer in all the preamp hype. Not by any stretch. In the grand scheme of things, they are not nearly as important as they are made out to be on internet forums. However, better pre's do help. Especially if you have good mics, converters, and a good room (as well a good source). IMHO the RNP beat out every cheap pre I have ever heard. It wasn't until a got a MUCH more expensive "clean" pre that I sold it. It isn't perfect, but if you can't make a great recording with it, you are doing something wrong. Not everybody needs a pre as good as the RNP. Most on this site wouldn't probably even hear the difference thru their crappy converters in an untreated room after they had their guitar amp cranked to 11 for the past three hours. This makes "upgrading" to an ART pre even that much more pointless though.
Nick's work is ready for a better pre if you ask me.............
I'm not too familar with building preamp, the last time i saw one with parts completely seperate from a solid state design was this: some plugs/switch (don't really matter, i'm just gonna assume they uses quality parts). The main components are the circuit board it self and the amp chips (let's face it, the chips are doing all the amplification). As far as I know, I don't know what the circuit does (maybe u wanna explain what it does), but most of the sounds/characteristics comes from the type of chip it uses.
Now i know i'm missing alot of the detail, so i would like an more detail explaination on the difference between the DMP3 and the RNP.
As far as the tube warm led meter, that's not the right "word", art has it wrong, people who uses the unit will tell you this. AND there's another full plate tube unit cheaper than the ART MPA, it's the EH 12AX7 single channel. And the bricks (around the same price @ 350). I'm not gonna keep telling you it's full plated, there's a bunch of people telling you already (as posted by link), so if you're not convince i don't know what to say, atleast i know i'm not the only one that says the unit is not full plate design.
Oh, i think i'm not really good with the "Search" function, i've been typing in RNP all day, and no one has posted what's in the unit, although they do tell you "it just sounds good". Maybe you wanna shine some light on the subject? i'm really curious what's in the unit that makes it 475.
and your theory of 10 dollars mic doesn't really work
1) it's not a 10 dollars mic, it's a cheap mic, but usable
2) Assuming that the mic doesn't open the potential of the RNP then it should sound the same on both pre, not a 1 sided poll that deffinitely saying one is better than the other.
Shadow_7
New member
From what I've read in other forums, the Art MPA Gold is the best of the cheap ones. As long as you replace the stock tubes.
I have the Art Tube MP. It works, but I can't really say that it does a great job. I have a decent mic and I'm definitely looking for a better preamp myself. The MPA Gold is a strong posibility. But I'm left wondering if I should just put the $1K+ to get a preamp that I'll be happy with for a decade or more to come. But that's just me.
I have the Art Tube MP. It works, but I can't really say that it does a great job. I have a decent mic and I'm definitely looking for a better preamp myself. The MPA Gold is a strong posibility. But I'm left wondering if I should just put the $1K+ to get a preamp that I'll be happy with for a decade or more to come. But that's just me.
Nick The Man
New member
WOW, hot argument. And a good one at that, very factual. Thanks for all the links and the A/B comparison. I'm really torn now, with so many factors and so many different choices.
I wish the RNP was rackmountable. Thats kinda big for me because I don't have many other places to put it. I suppose I could get a rack shelf or something for it. I do have to say in those samples they sounded pretty damn similar and both excellent at that. I guess there is more to it than just pre selection.
Someone else also mentioned not bothering with the TAMPA if I didn't plan on using the EQ or the compressor. Well to tell ya the truth I don't really plan on using them. I just want a decent preamp. I'm starting to think I could spend my money on something more "worth it" I guess I could say. NL5 is saying the pre is not as important as it is made out to be.
At this point I have the Octane and the four pres on my interface. Although the interface has 4 pres it also has 4 1/4" ins, so I figured I'd buy some pres to feed into those last 4 ins. Maybe it's not nessicary? What do you guys think?
NL5, thanks for the compliment, have you had a listen to my latest mix?
I wish the RNP was rackmountable. Thats kinda big for me because I don't have many other places to put it. I suppose I could get a rack shelf or something for it. I do have to say in those samples they sounded pretty damn similar and both excellent at that. I guess there is more to it than just pre selection.
Someone else also mentioned not bothering with the TAMPA if I didn't plan on using the EQ or the compressor. Well to tell ya the truth I don't really plan on using them. I just want a decent preamp. I'm starting to think I could spend my money on something more "worth it" I guess I could say. NL5 is saying the pre is not as important as it is made out to be.
At this point I have the Octane and the four pres on my interface. Although the interface has 4 pres it also has 4 1/4" ins, so I figured I'd buy some pres to feed into those last 4 ins. Maybe it's not nessicary? What do you guys think?
NL5, thanks for the compliment, have you had a listen to my latest mix?
warlock110
New member
If you're not using it, then i wouldn't bother buying more stuff, i'm very budget minded, and only buy what i think i might need to use. If you need to fill up those 4 slots, there are other pre out there that has 4 channel. I think in the world of preamp, the more channel it has the quality/price ratio goes down because it costs them less to put a bunch of them in the same case using the same power input ect...
I have nothing against the RNP, and i'm not here to put it down, i'm simply suspicious of why it is as good as people claim. Take example the DMP3, people says "well it's uses blurbrown chip, so it's got good signal/noise ratio, blurbrown is made by TI and it's popular", with that, atleast i have some sort of fact to roll on and as reference, other cheap pre uses cheaper amp sounds horrible compare to the DMP3. Or when people talks about the brick they would say "well it's a full plated tube design based on it's cousin the VIPRE that's much more expensive, and it's got a transformer so we know it's not cheaply made" blah blah, again we have some sort of evidence to rely on. With the RNP people simply claims "well, it's great, stands with the best...." blah blah, but people fail to tell why, and that's not very informative.
I admit, i have this stupid habits of reading about this stuff on messege board, when i was looking through the possible cheap pres, i stumble across the RNP, so i went on like 4-5 different message board searching "RNP" in the tittle, lol, i basically went through hundreds of threat for comparsion of the RNP, and until this day, the only time i've heard about what components is inside the RNP was on 1 topic, unfortunately the topic got deleted for whatever reason i do not know. If i remember correctly it uses the INS163 amp (or something similar to that name, i don't have photographic memory lol, i can't remember all these stuff).
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dickiefunk
New member
I've also heard a lot of people say the Tampa is. I haven't tried mine yet because it came without the power supply and there's been a postal strike over here
I have the DMP3 and have been extremely impressed with it. All the posts I've read about the Tampa say it is better than the DMP3. By how much is going to be debatable but I'm looking forward to trying mine anyway!
Kevin Deschwazi
Well-known member
It's never that simple.
Another simple, transformerless, IC opamp design is the DAV BG-1 and everyone's been coming in their calvin kleins over that pre for the last few years.
It seems we're becoming more obsessed with circuit design despite the fact that most of us know little, if anything about it (myself included). Only your ears will tell you if a piece of gear has been well made in terms of design and components used.
Be wary of people on the internet trying to justify their purchases to themselves. I'd be wanting to convince myself of a "night and day" difference too if I'd just splurged £X00 on a shiny new preamp.
not sure if this could help
but i use a Presonus Eureka, its actually a channel strip with a pre-amp, compressor, and equalizer.....
do keep in mind i only record vocals and use an AKG Perception 400 mic, so i'm not sure how it would react if your using it to track instruments
but overall i have no complaints for it, i got mines off of E-bay for around $300-$400 (i 4get) fresh out the box, i've seen it retailed at almost $600, so don't get discouraged about the price range of an item you like, if you want it bad enough just go the extra mile to search for it and you might end up getting a nice deal on it.
but i use a Presonus Eureka, its actually a channel strip with a pre-amp, compressor, and equalizer.....
do keep in mind i only record vocals and use an AKG Perception 400 mic, so i'm not sure how it would react if your using it to track instruments
but overall i have no complaints for it, i got mines off of E-bay for around $300-$400 (i 4get) fresh out the box, i've seen it retailed at almost $600, so don't get discouraged about the price range of an item you like, if you want it bad enough just go the extra mile to search for it and you might end up getting a nice deal on it.
warlock110
New member
ears is a very subjective matter, it's not consistence across the board (hense why people would mix with monitors instead of regular speakers because monitor translate more consistence, that's not to say monitor are 100% accurate, we know it's not). Same thing with ears, different people hear things differently, that's why it's hard to judge. Plus i'm not sure if most people on here have trained ears (i know there's a group of experienced people that have great ears, but i'm not really sure if that applies to the general public on here). So at the end i still want to look at parts and their performance according to their data, or atleast their price to see how "good" it is. Not to say that parts are 100% consistence because it's not, but let's trust that the factory that produce it has good quality control lol.
PS: I don't know squat about circuit design, so i can't say anything about them or how much they effect the sound, when i look at a circuit, i think to myself that with the resistor and such, it's just a controler for moving power (but how much do i know, i've never learned about them).
warlock110
New member
the Eurika is 300 new at GC, what i've heard is that it's got a huge mark up, i decided to call them up and ask for price, and they told me 300.