How necessary is a rack in a digital studio?

I had to stop using it Justsomeguy simply because it was the cuase & enabler of my reverb addiction. Once I stopped plugging into it I managed to use reverb only occasionally and much more judiciously.
Your mate is a good mate. Altruism is still alive and well!
I think I may be tempted to try just a taste...

:laughings: You make reverb units sound like crack :D Although i do completely get your point, although i was the other way around. My mixes always used to be way too dry.... then i found the microverb and my eyes were opened to the awesomeness of reverb. Even then though it's taken me 5 years to move up from the smaller settings to the larger settings.

Tbh now i think of it the same friend has done a similar thing three times - once with the microverb, then with an old 70's Kay Les Paul Copy, and more recently with a Pro Amp "demon"!

Every time i went to his house i used to play his old kay and i fell in love with it. I began scouring ebay for one and then, lo and behold, he gave it to me for my birthday! Similar story with the amp; was trawling for a small simple amp on ebay and kept sending him links to get his view (i have a lot of respect for him as a guitarist) and i found an old Pro Amp. He then replied "dude, i have one of those amps that i never use. You're more than welcome to it". Again, i offered him some money but he just said "dude, i'd rather keep it in the family and know it's being used and treated kindly". He really is an awesome friend :)

It's really nice as there's a group of about 10 of us who share gear between us constantly and it really has become our kind of musical family.
 
I've had a bunch of funky weird rack gear for a while and never used it as I didn't have an interface with enough outputs. I got a Roland Octa-Capture recently and finally got my rack setup, but it's mostly for weird/fun post-processing (like running things through an old Ursa Major Space Station reverb or Super Timeline delay).

I've got a few preamps/compressors (FMR RNP/RNC and Art MPA Gold/PRO VLA II) and I'm happy with the sound, but if I'm being honest with myself I was probably just as happy with the sound of the Octa-Capture direct (it has built in pres and compressors on each channel...).

I guess I just like the lights and VU meters glowing when I'm in there. Ha.
 
This is one of those threads that could go on forever...
key word in the title nec·es·sar·y (n s -s r ). adj. 1. Absolutely essential.

I dont think the outboard gear is required anymore.
The plugs and 24 bit and power of the pc's these days, from what I read and hear, the vintage gear is more a preference luxury, than a requirement.

Plug's and ITB is so powerful and it keeps getting stronger.
just looking at the 1990's recording magazines, and pc recording, what was hi-end then, in current standards is now crap. computers and software that appears prehistoric already. 66mhz pentium 1993 .... lol
I wonder how pc recording was on a 66mhz 1993 Pentium? crashes and maybe a few plugs until it froze up.
outboard gear was sought after to warm up the sterile digital tracks supposedly.

Now in 2013, if I was starting out today,(or had money right now) and was serious, probably something like the Apollo. It would be hi-end today, and a lot of everything with hi-quality. no rack necessary.

but beyond "necessary".... the pro's all have the bling of LA2A and U47 and U87's, vintage gear..add in really well done rooms and talent, you have Gil Norton-ville.
 
I dont think the outboard gear is required anymore.
The plugs and 24 bit and power of the pc's these days, from what I read and hear, the vintage gear is more a preference luxury, than a requirement.

Plug's and ITB is so powerful and it keeps getting stronger.

Well...you don't really require plugs either...I mean, if the music is done really well, just a mic and something to record to.

But we know that's not the reality. So....just like hardware, the plugs you use are also a preference. Some folks just prefer the hardware version instead of the plug version...not as a "luxury", but as a preference.

Point is...as strong as ITB may be, it doesn't always replace hardware if it's hardware you prefer.
Which is why the pros still have tons of hardware, and they use it every day....alongside the ITB. :)
 
the thread was on the rack. but I agree, I have Hybrid = hard/software... and in the real world there is no needing to be one or the other.

just for forum chat though, how necessary is a rack in a digital studio?

but there it is...the Wants vs Needs debate.
 
Well....like was noted earlier I think, even in a digital studio, if you have a bunch of preamps you like to use, you'll need a rack.
Also....some folks like to apply some processing going in, so there's more rack gear.
Plus....if you have multi-channel conveters, there's more rack gear.

So even in a primarily ITB setup....you could probably fill at least one decent rack with gear, but, no, you don't *need* to.
 
Point is...as strong as ITB may be, it doesn't always replace hardware if it's hardware you prefer.
Which is why the pros still have tons of hardware, and they use it every day....alongside the ITB. :)

That's one of the reasons that they have racks of hardware.

The other reason why pros still have tons of hardware is because they have been recording for many years, and have invested considerable amounts in equipping their studios. Even if most of the functions and quality of the hardware can be met ITB these days, I can't imagine they would want to ditch all the equipment that they have spent so much on and are now so familiar with.
 
For sure....equipment piles up over the years, and pros usually can afford the expensive stuff, so they obviously will hold on to it...and then it's also about "comfort zones", getting use to certain SOPs so much, that it takes a real compelling reason to change. Then there is also pure preference...one thing just works/sounds better than the other to you.

I remember when we had that CLA contest and Q&A here on HR, and I asked CLA how much he used his own signature Waves plugs VS all those racks of hardware that it was modeled after, shown in his videos...and he said he pretty much went with the hardware, but of course he also said the plugs are used too when appropriate...though I think that was more him just plugging his plugs! :D
 
I flip[flop....one minute its the rack and outboard gear, it has that allure like a tube amplifier and a US Stratocaster, a SM7 + outboard preamp...but then the ITB offers up so much, and really , if tweaked, can get so close to about anything cost wise its probably better for my wallet. but the ITB seems kind of painful and non-fun at times, where as the hardware can be so cool and easy, and a person feels like they are doing something real, instead of just highlighting the wave and having the plug fix everything.
kind of like real drums vs e-drums. both have the positives.

I think I changed my mind...it is necessary to have outboard gear aka rack... but maybe not for tone reasons only.

wait hold on...I think I changed my mind again... :facepalm:
 
Well...you don't really require plugs either...I mean, if the music is done really well, just a mic and something to record to.

this was something that shocked me more than anything, when I went to my first pro studio, with my sons band.
they used SM58 vox, into a channel.
the Bass was DI into a channel.
the guitar was a57 into a channel.
the drums got fancier with C414 oh, 421 kick, and several clip mics and dual snare sm57 (but one was taken off later).. into a few channels.13 channels I think or 11.
Note: a beautiful room, a beautiful control room, amazing sound, playback...
SSL4000, KRK Expose speakers...and a laptop with Protools, I think the convertors Lynx, but not 100%.

but my agreement is, it was so simple and it sounded so good. no plugs at all, not even rack gear...just the music to the channel strip to the protools.
 

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this was something that shocked me more than anything, when I went to my first pro studio, with my sons band.

That's something I wish I had more opportunity to do....record with/as a whole band, with most of it going down at one time. You can get away with more of a basic approach, and you get the whole sound, at one time.

Having to do so much of the recording by myslef...it's all about layering track after track, while all always trying to "hear" the whole sound before you even have it...and sometimes that forces your hand, and you start looking for embelishments in advance of the whole sound, 'cuz you kinda' feel like each single track has to be at a certain high quality level before you move to the next track....as opposed to instanly hearing most of the whole sound that with a bunch of musicians recording together.
 
yeah man, a whole different approach. but youre right if you get it right in the tracking there isnt a lot of "bad-sounds" work to require plugs and outboard/rack stuff. although the channel did have filter, eq, compress, obviously a preamp.
so I guess the mixer would be technically "rack" gear, in a way....definitely not all ITB. They werent plugging straight into a interface/ITB or anything.

I bet in that room though, with the same everything, a person could do well skipping the mixer SSL for like an Apollo or something, 16 INPUT interface...you think?
 
The only thing you NEED is an interface.

Like anything else in life there are plusses and minuses. I could write a book on this but I'll keep it to the point.

MINIMAL GEAR:
Pros:
1) Less costs as all of that outboard gear will eat up your bank account very quickly. Even if a LA2A plug is $500, the real deal is closer to $2k
2) Without being tied to a 12 space rack of gear, you can grab your laptop and go record your coffee shop gig with minimal hassles.
Cons:
1) You are relying very heavily on your computers CPU to do everything. This tends to mean lots of latency and weird glitches
2) G.A.S. (Gear acquisition syndrome) always rears its ugly head

OUTBOARD GEAR:
Pros:
1) Less stress on your computers CPU, means less latency and weird
2) Plug ins are nice, but there is something to be said for a really nice analog preamp or compressor.
Cons:
1) With all the extra outboard equipment, your system isn't that portable
2) Time spent making sure everything in your studio is "talking" correctly

Currently my rack consists of 4 pieces (6 spaces): Presonus 1818vsl interface, Monster Pro2500 power conditioner, Digidesign Eleven Rack, Muse Research Receptor. That's it.


I hope this helps in some way. :D
 
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