A Good Investment?

E

EdJames

New member
I presently run an Audio Technica AT4040 into an ART Pro Channel preamp then into a Delta 44. I only record male RnB vocals and like to do all my mixing on my computer rather than an outboard. I record in a homemade booth (a huge rug on two large frames with a reflexion filter in front of that) so the sound is deadened.

A colleague has suggested that I upgrade in the following manner to maximise my sound. Each of these upgrades could be 6 months apart, so I'd appreciate your thoughts...

UPGRADE 1
Avalon 737 preamp (£1,200)

UPGRADE 2
A Neumann U87 microphone (£1,200)

UPGRADE 3
A proper home booth (£2,000)

Can anybody recommend any cheaper alternatives or alternatively let me know if this is going to improve my audio quality significantly? I've never used any of these items before, so I'm unsure of their effect...
 
EdJames said:
I presently run an Audio Technica AT4040 into an ART Pro Channel preamp then into a Delta 44. I only record male RnB vocals and like to do all my mixing on my computer rather than an outboard. I record in a homemade booth (a huge rug on two large frames with a reflexion filter in front of that) so the sound is deadened.

A colleague has suggested that I upgrade in the following manner to maximise my sound. Each of these upgrades could be 6 months apart, so I'd appreciate your thoughts...

UPGRADE 1
Avalon 737 preamp (£1,200)

UPGRADE 2
A Neumann U87 microphone (£1,200)

UPGRADE 3
A proper home booth (£2,000)

Can anybody recommend any cheaper alternatives or alternatively let me know if this is going to improve my audio quality significantly? I've never used any of these items before, so I'm unsure of their effect...
Click to expand...

Glad to see you're still doing your thing.. I remember you from RM.com from many years ago.. The things you're looking at upgrading are great big steps in the right direction, but don't expect it's going to be automatic.. I just got a u87.. It's such a great mic, but your room has to really be on point or you wont get the world class sound it's capable of providing.. If I were you I would focus as much on the interface.. The mic and preamp can only take you so far until you upgrade to a better interface / converters.

I also use a reflexion filter in an enclosed booth made of pvc pipe and moving blankets.. It works great for me! You can always improve on your treatment and that can never hurt.. but if your space is already fairly dead with what you have now then I wouldn't expect that's going to make a huge difference..

I've heard a lot of your stuff, and i'd be willing to bet you would sound good through the u87, but if you're in the southern IL area ever and want to try it out.. I'd let you in exhange for a hook..

Overall, I think you have A LOT of cheaper options.. I would start with the interface and go from there.. a great interface and great converters open up your options considerably. Keep doing your thing!
 
Mr. ROUSH said:
Glad to see you're still doing your thing.. I remember you from RM.com from many years ago.. The things you're looking at upgrading are great big steps in the right direction, but don't expect it's going to be automatic.. I just got a u87.. It's such a great mic, but your room has to really be on point or you wont get the world class sound it's capable of providing.. If I were you I would focus as much on the interface.. The mic and preamp can only take you so far until you upgrade to a better interface / converters.

I also use a reflexion filter in an enclosed booth made of pvc pipe and moving blankets.. It works great for me! You can always improve on your treatment and that can never hurt.. but if your space is already fairly dead with what you have now then I wouldn't expect that's going to make a huge difference..

I've heard a lot of your stuff, and i'd be willing to bet you would sound good through the u87, but if you're in the southern IL area ever and want to try it out.. I'd let you in exhange for a hook..

Overall, I think you have A LOT of cheaper options.. I would start with the interface and go from there.. a great interface and great converters open up your options considerably. Keep doing your thing!
Click to expand...

Happy to throw you a hook, although I'm based in the UK so there's no need to let me come and use your U87. If I remember correctly you're a producer right?

In terms of the interface, do you mean replacing the Delta 44? If so, what is a good step up from that? Also, do you have any recommendations of alternatives for the Avalon?
 
EdJames said:
Happy to throw you a hook, although I'm based in the UK so there's no need to let me come and use your U87. If I remember correctly you're a producer right?

In terms of the interface, do you mean replacing the Delta 44? If so, what is a good step up from that? Also, do you have any recommendations of alternatives for the Avalon?
Click to expand...


That'd be excellent! I like to call myself a producer, but first I'm a recording artist / mixing engineer and really just recently got seriously into producing.. It'd be excellent to work with you.

And yes, I mean replacing the Delta.. that would by my first move if I were you.. There are lots of options that are a step up from the delta, but if you want to possibly save yourself future upgrades.. I would look at the Rosetta series from apogee.. they have GREAT converters and will allow you to really tap the quality of a given mic/preamp combo.

As for alternatives to the Avalon.. I would look at some great river pre's.. I would look at Neve Portico units as far as less expensive options that are comparable qualitywise. Want something better than an Avalon and price isn't a factor? Go with the Manley Voxbox all the way.. providing it's a good match for the application and you're voice. Best of luck to ya.

Hit me up sometime.. roushy1@gmail.com
 
Mr. ROUSH said:
That'd be excellent! I like to call myself a producer, but first I'm a recording artist / mixing engineer and really just recently got seriously into producing.. It'd be excellent to work with you.

And yes, I mean replacing the Delta.. that would by my first move if I were you.. There are lots of options that are a step up from the delta, but if you want to possibly save yourself future upgrades.. I would look at the Rosetta series from apogee.. they have GREAT converters and will allow you to really tap the quality of a given mic/preamp combo.

As for alternatives to the Avalon.. I would look at some great river pre's.. I would look at Neve Portico units as far as less expensive options that are comparable qualitywise. Want something better than an Avalon and price isn't a factor? Go with the Manley Voxbox all the way.. providing it's a good match for the application and you're voice. Best of luck to ya.

Hit me up sometime.. roushy1@gmail.com
Click to expand...

Appreciate the advice bit...

...Rosetta appears to be £1,500 - any cheaper interface alternatives?
...I can pick up an Avalon as cheap as a Neve Portico in the UK even if I import (around £1,000).
...found the Great River ME-1NV Single Channel Mic Pre for £945 inc. postage - is that my best option right now?
...Voxbox is way out of my price range!
 
EdJames said:
Appreciate the advice bit...

...Rosetta appears to be £1,500 - any cheaper interface alternatives?
...I can pick up an Avalon as cheap as a Neve Portico in the UK even if I import (around £1,000).
...found the Great River ME-1NV Single Channel Mic Pre for £945 inc. postage - is that my best option right now?
...Voxbox is way out of my price range!
Click to expand...

Tell you what.. let me get some more info from you, and then I'll suggest some alternatives.. Are you using protools? Also what is your overall budget? Will you be recording primarily yourself and occasionaly others, or will you be recording a lot of different people.. How much I/O do you need?

Let me know and then I'll get back to ya.. later.
 
Basically, I only want to use it for myself to record vocals via Adobe Audition 3.0, therefore I only need one I/O (I presume that means Input/Ouput?).
 
http://pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/product/RME-HDSPe-AIO?sku=500411&src=3WWRWXGB&ZYXSEM=0 This is for use with interfaces that have aes/spdif output.. this is the way to go.. 400 pounds.. (your pc must be equipped with pcie slots for this.. if your pc is newer it should have this.. if you're not sure then tell me what your mother board is and I'll check)

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/search.php?s=rosetta+200 899 pounds

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/230/ 400 pounds

And one of the mics below (providing they are a good match for your voice)

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Blueberry/ 500 pounds option 1

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Dragonfly/ 400 pounds option 2

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/MA200/ 500 pounds option 3

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/KSM44/ 400 pounds options 4

The above would put you at either 2100 pounds or 2200 pounds depending on what mic you go with.. either way that would leave you with 300 to 400 pounds for cables and accessories..

since the rosetta is deffinitely in your budget.. I have a hard time recommending anything else.. not that there aren't suitable alternatives.. but if you don't want to sacrifice quality and leave yourself the option to go HD.. then you cannot go wrong with it.. preamps are another story.. the aphex is interchangible of course.. I like the focusrite voicemaster as well.. the mic / preamp may of course change.. but the one thing solid that I would absolutely do is get the rosetta with the aes/spdif pcie card.. butter!

Hope this gives you food for thought.. Let me know if there's anything else I can help with, and best of luck.. your music is tight!
 
Mr. Roush

Mr. ROUSH said:
http://pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/product/RME-HDSPe-AIO?sku=500411&src=3WWRWXGB&ZYXSEM=0 This is for use with interfaces that have aes/spdif output.. this is the way to go.. 400 pounds.. (your pc must be equipped with pcie slots for this.. if your pc is newer it should have this.. if you're not sure then tell me what your mother board is and I'll check)

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/search.php?s=rosetta+200 899 pounds

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/230/ 400 pounds

And one of the mics below (providing they are a good match for your voice)

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Blueberry/ 500 pounds option 1

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Dragonfly/ 400 pounds option 2

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/MA200/ 500 pounds option 3

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/KSM44/ 400 pounds options 4

The above would put you at either 2100 pounds or 2200 pounds depending on what mic you go with.. either way that would leave you with 300 to 400 pounds for cables and accessories..

since the rosetta is deffinitely in your budget.. I have a hard time recommending anything else.. not that there aren't suitable alternatives.. but if you don't want to sacrifice quality and leave yourself the option to go HD.. then you cannot go wrong with it.. preamps are another story.. the aphex is interchangible of course.. I like the focusrite voicemaster as well.. the mic / preamp may of course change.. but the one thing solid that I would absolutely do is get the rosetta with the aes/spdif pcie card.. butter!

Hope this gives you food for thought.. Let me know if there's anything else I can help with, and best of luck.. your music is tight!
Click to expand...


Mr. Roush,
You Rock! Good choices by the way. I wish I caught this thread a bit earlier. Ed, Feel free to call me at work. I'll be glad to help you figure out what to get. (I love the MA200 BTW).
 
Smogger said:
Mr. Roush,
You Rock! Good choices by the way. I wish I caught this thread a bit earlier. Ed, Feel free to call me at work. I'll be glad to help you figure out what to get. (I love the MA200 BTW).
Click to expand...

Well thanks Steve, but actually you rock.. over half of my research is info that came from Robby Resnick of Sweetwater.. tell him I said hi.. I love the MA200 as well..

ED call these guys on the real.. great, great service and support.. they even put candy in the bottom of the box with your order..
 
Smogger said:
Mr. Roush,
You Rock! Good choices by the way. I wish I caught this thread a bit earlier. Ed, Feel free to call me at work. I'll be glad to help you figure out what to get. (I love the MA200 BTW).
Click to expand...

Thanks for the offer, but I'm in the UK, so a long distance call and shipping charges aren't really an option.
 
Mr. ROUSH said:
http://pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/product/RME-HDSPe-AIO?sku=500411&src=3WWRWXGB&ZYXSEM=0 This is for use with interfaces that have aes/spdif output.. this is the way to go.. 400 pounds.. (your pc must be equipped with pcie slots for this.. if your pc is newer it should have this.. if you're not sure then tell me what your mother board is and I'll check)

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/search.php?s=rosetta+200 899 pounds

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/230/ 400 pounds

And one of the mics below (providing they are a good match for your voice)

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Blueberry/ 500 pounds option 1

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Dragonfly/ 400 pounds option 2

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/MA200/ 500 pounds option 3

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/KSM44/ 400 pounds options 4

The above would put you at either 2100 pounds or 2200 pounds depending on what mic you go with.. either way that would leave you with 300 to 400 pounds for cables and accessories..

since the rosetta is deffinitely in your budget.. I have a hard time recommending anything else.. not that there aren't suitable alternatives.. but if you don't want to sacrifice quality and leave yourself the option to go HD.. then you cannot go wrong with it.. preamps are another story.. the aphex is interchangible of course.. I like the focusrite voicemaster as well.. the mic / preamp may of course change.. but the one thing solid that I would absolutely do is get the rosetta with the aes/spdif pcie card.. butter!

Hope this gives you food for thought.. Let me know if there's anything else I can help with, and best of luck.. your music is tight!
Click to expand...

Some great food for thought, but sadly it's no longer two pounds to the dollar, it's virtually 1:1 these days thanks to your banks managing to push us into recession! On that basis, you've priced me up around £4,700.

I can get the Avalon 737s and a Neumann U87 for just over £2,000.
 
EdJames said:
Some great food for thought, but sadly it's no longer two pounds to the dollar, it's virtually 1:1 these days thanks to your banks managing to push us into recession! On that basis, you've priced me up around £4,700.

I can get the Avalon 737s and a Neumann U87 for just over £2,000.
Click to expand...

Ahh.. alright, sorry about that.. I must have used a dated currency calculator.. well that's certainly not a bad choice.. I think you wouldn't regret doing that.. Sounds like you're getting a great deal.. you getting those new for that price?
 
you already have a good mic, there are better options but there is no reason why that 4040 should hold you back. the preamp that you have has also been known to give good results although i would upgrade that first. there have been some world class, and expensive, options listed here although i would be tempted to try out a grace 101 or GAP pre73 on a lower budget. i say that mostly because those are the two that i have my eye on right now, i'm currently using an ART MPA Gold.

i think that you would be spending your money best by treating your space well and paying attention to your monitoring. once you are sure that you are hearing everything right and are not picking up bad reflections in the recording then focus on mics and pres. otherwise you just have a bunch of expensive gear thats not performing as well as it could.
 
EdJames said:
I presently run an Audio Technica AT4040 into an ART Pro Channel preamp then into a Delta 44. I only record male RnB vocals and like to do all my mixing on my computer rather than an outboard. I record in a homemade booth (a huge rug on two large frames with a reflexion filter in front of that) so the sound is deadened.

A colleague has suggested that I upgrade in the following manner to maximise my sound. Each of these upgrades could be 6 months apart, so I'd appreciate your thoughts...

UPGRADE 1
Avalon 737 preamp (£1,200)

UPGRADE 2
A Neumann U87 microphone (£1,200)

UPGRADE 3
A proper home booth (£2,000)

Can anybody recommend any cheaper alternatives or alternatively let me know if this is going to improve my audio quality significantly? I've never used any of these items before, so I'm unsure of their effect...
Click to expand...


Do the booth....and get a few Dewalt powertools and do some online designs...save a thousand or so....and upgrade the ART to a less noisy preamp...the Avalon is pretty first class but there are other options for less.
 
EdJames said:
Some great food for thought, but sadly it's no longer two pounds to the dollar, it's virtually 1:1 these days thanks to your banks managing to push us into recession! On that basis, you've priced me up around £4,700.

I can get the Avalon 737s and a Neumann U87 for just over £2,000.
Click to expand...

I'm just back from Northern Ireland and sterlings back up to around $1.65... I don't think it got much worse then $1.40... but certainly better than 1:1.

I had to send $30,000 over there to get construction started back at the start of this year when the exchange was 2:1, kills me, if I could have waited 6 months I would have saved $9,000 (That covers just about everything on this list).
 
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