Some things to think about when choosing mics.

[Sennheiser]

Grasshoppa has been enlightened!

What an outstanding source of information on microphones.

Harvey, I had never ventured that many pages back in the history to see that thread.

Now I understand. Your explanations and examples blew me away. I have an AEE degree and I was able to make sense of much of the material. Not that I needed it with the easy way you explain complex technical material, but it helped.

And now I know why the 441 is so damn good and how they got it that way.

I think that the Sennheiser MD441U was chosen for Nicks because of the timbre of her voice and her style of singing. I would have never been able to figure that out before. She used that mic for three albums and always used it live until 1997. That is just my opinion based on the information that was presented and being very familiar with her vocal style and her timbre.

I have noticed her voice has changed slightly since then and other mics have been used. Her voice has deepened and is slightly rougher than it was in her younger days.

Thank you for what I believe to be the equivilent of an entire semester of college. It is much appreciated.

Someone on that thread compiled all of your material in Word format and I bookmarked it for reference for the times I get stuck.

Whew...I'm still sitting here with my jaw practically down to the keyboard.

[littledog]

Originally posted by Michael Jones

Could you (or anyone else) explain this: It seems to me that the small dia. condensor mics I have used on my grand piano, seem to lose definition in the A2 - A3 octave. Why is that?

mic positioning?

[Michael Jones]

Originally posted by littledog


mic positioning?

Well, I mean... it... but...if....

You might think that, but I have tried a multitude of mic positions, and while it may sound slightly less pronounced on some positions, it's still there,(that lack of detail in that range) or... ummm... not there.

I feel, and of course, I may be completely wrong, but the results I have had from numerous experiments with positioning, and various small diameter condensors, yeilds this lack of definition in the low - low mid range. With LD condensors, this problem is
non-existent.

I could of course keep using LD condensors on my piano, they work well, and sound very nice, I'm just trying to learn the technical aspects of whats happening.

[littledog]

If you are getting the results you want with other methods, than the question is somewhat moot.

But in general, small diaphragm condensers are more accurate across a wider frequency range than large diaphragm. Perhaps the large diaphragms are giving you a boost in the region which you are interpreting as the small diaphragms cutting. Or maybe you are just using some dogs for small diaphragm mics.

What specific mics you have tried? I can say that I have used Earthworks QTCs (about as small a diaphragm as you can get) on almost every piano recording I have done in the last few years in my studio, and get a stellar sound. (The piano helps a lot with that, unfortunately, the room does not!) But I have a buddy who uses a pair of M149's on his very similar piano, and he is rhapsodic about the result. Two VERY different mic choices... with excellent results for both.

[participant]

And yes, this post by littledog makes him the force of nature that he is


Chad

[Michael Jones]

Originally posted by littledog
If you are getting the results you want with other methods, than the question is somewhat moot.

But in general, small diaphragm condensers are more accurate across a wider frequency range than large diaphragm. Perhaps the large diaphragms are giving you a boost in the region which you are interpreting as the small diaphragms cutting. Or maybe you are just using some dogs for small diaphragm mics.

What specific mics you have tried?

Shure SM81's primarily. Not a mic I would consider a dog.

Well, I posted this before , and you were very helpful in your response; saying something to the affect that "...you might be hearing a low mid presence peak...from the large diaphrams"

Could very well be, but that still doesn't explain the loss of definition from the small diameter condensors.

In the linked thread, scroll down to my post that appears right after yours.

[Sennheiser]

If the problem isn't the mics or mic placement, maybe it's time to start looking at the piano.

Has a tech looked at the hammer felts lately or checked the regulation and trapwork?

Just a thought.

[littledog]

Originally posted by Michael Jones

Shure SM81's primarily. Not a mic I would consider a dog.

Not necessarily a dog, but not my favorite mic for pianos either. Try a pair of omni small diaphragms if you can - especially in light of your specific problem. You won't get proximity effect from the strings nearest the mics like in a cardioid mic. That alone may "solve" your problem.

[Michael Jones]

Originally posted by Sennheiser
If the problem isn't the mics or mic placement, maybe it's time to start looking at the piano.

Has a tech looked at the hammer felts lately or checked the regulation and trapwork?

Just a thought.

I don't think the problem is the piano.
It's a 7'-2" Boston Semi Concert Grand. I have it tuned and regulated 4-6 times a year. So it's kept in top notch shape.

[Michael Jones]

It's really no big deal guys. Like I say, I get very nice results with a pair of LD condensors. I'm just curious why the drop off in definition on the SD Condensors. I recently threw a pair of MC012's at it too. Better, but not perfect. Maybe if I took the lid completely off, instead of just full open?