New Automated Microphone

W

Webby McWeber

New member
Hi. So, I work with linear actuators. We're always looking for projects and whatnot, so I thought I would head up my own project. I rigged up this microphone to be automated. This way, if you're standing in front of it, you just push the button and raise it or lower it to the correct position. This can even work from behind a screen if need be. I'm not quite finished yet, because I want to automate the boom so it lifts the mic as well.


Does anyone have any thoughts or comments on this or how you would improve on it?

Cheers!

It's been put on my work's website because that's essentially what I did it for.



This is how I went about building this: The Automated Mic Project
 
It sounds like you have a solution for which you are trying to find problems.

However the problem of raising and lowering a microphone stand is, to my knowledge, not one that has caused anyone any real hardship. It takes someone a couple of seconds. To automate that is applying a level of complexity and cost to something that is really not worth it.

People involved in home recording are more likely inclined to invest in a new microphone rather than an electric stand for it.
 
Hi Matt,

if you look around on youtube, there are some videos about automated mic positioning.
It could be nice for a one man studio to move mics in front of a cabinet, for example, while sitting in the control room and listening to the monitors.
So, you basically would have to be able to move the mic in the horizontal and vertical plane and pivot the mic in two axes in the mic holder.
All this should be basically noiseless.
I think it would be necessary to automatically keep the mic and booms from touching anything, for speaker membranes or instruments are fragile,
and it would be good to be able to store a few positions to be able to compare two settings, and to reliably get back to those settings.
Anything much below these requests is pretty much useless, imho.
Though I don't see myself coughing up the necessary dough for such a machine...
 
it's an interesting idea but I honestly feel like mic positioning is one of the most important parts of audio engineering and it still has to be done manually, where is the market for this?
 
We're a very critical bunch, huh?
Webby, I have to say it's cool that you can do that sort of thing and it's cool that you took the time to share.
Largely, I agree that it might not have that many practical applications it the current form, but it's still very cool.

I remember talking to a member here a while back about a remote control guitar amp-mic stand or gooseneck.
The idea would have been kind like those invasive medical cameras. It would be able to rotate so the mic head would draw a circle..like you can do with a straight finger. That way you could adjust whether you're on or off axis.

The possibility of the whole thing moving up and/or side to side would seal the deal.
I bet people would pay for that!
 
I could see where minor/precise movements would have some application. Like for moving a microphone in an iso room from the sound booth while you listen for the sweet spot on the speaker cab blaring at 100W. Worth your weight in gold not having to shut down and trudge in, move a 1/2 inch and then see if it sounds better/worse.
 
Thanks everybody for the thoughts on the build. My initial thoughts where that it would be good to have something that could save even a second or two of time, but after thinking about it - here are the benefits that I've come up with to this machine. Although, I'm not planning on marketing this. I just thought it was a cool dealy to share.

1. This is essentially a self-locking mechanism. I don't worry about the stand moving, even if I were to put my entire weight on the mic. It just won't move an inch because of the weight rating for the actuator.
2. This can be fitted with a control system that has memory functions. So if you have two recording sessions with two different people, if their heights are different they can both be saved in the presets and brought back up with a single button. This might also be handy for shows where three or four bands are playing.
3. When I automated the boom as well, it'll have one more dimension of automation.
4. When I'm recording by myself, it just saves a little bit of hassle having to adjust. But then I'm really lazy! :P

A side to side or even circular motion of the mic is entirely doable. I think that's a fantastic idea. I'd have to mount it onto something that could rotate a little better. Or even mount it so it just rotates along the thread of the mic screw dealy. The actuators themselves are running on lead screws, so its just a matter of finding one that fit. Hmm. Awesome ideas.

As for the noise, I don't see how it could be noiseless :(. Electric actuators and all that. It's about under 45 db right now, but far from whisper quiet.

As for the precise positioning, using a slow actuator can bring about as much precision as anything. These actuators are used in high tech manufacturing operations where they pick and place all sorts of tiny things. I'm going to try and find out what the precision measurement is, but I don't know it off-hand.

Phew! Good times!
 
Raise/lower/rotate at the stand. Raise/lower at the boom. In/Out at the boom or mike holder. Don't care about noise. How much to build a prototype? How much would it run in production?

This is a great idea for big studios, specifically for finding sweet spots in rooms/on cabinets/in around drums, etc. You may have your niche market already set. One of these that could be guaranteed for 5 years and cost less than $500 in production would probably sell on these merits alone. :D

You should definitely seek a patent before proceeding.
 
BroKen_H said:
Raise/lower/rotate at the stand. Raise/lower at the boom. In/Out at the boom or mike holder. Don't care about noise. How much to build a prototype? How much would it run in production?
Click to expand...

That's sort of the boon on this particular project for me. I work for a linear actuator manufacturer, so the cost is entirely minimal for the prototype. I've access to all the products required for this project. And I've already got access to the resources needed in production. I'm not sure exactly how much it would cost, but since we already manufacture actuators in large quantities, I'm halfway there.

Thanks very much for the ideas. I'm going to work on this some more and see what comes along. :)
 
Steenamaroo said:
We're a very critical bunch, huh?
Webby, I have to say it's cool that you can do that sort of thing and it's cool that you took the time to share.
Largely, I agree that it might not have that many practical applications it the current form, but it's still very cool.

I remember talking to a member here a while back about a remote control guitar amp-mic stand or gooseneck.
The idea would have been kind like those invasive medical cameras. It would be able to rotate so the mic head would draw a circle..like you can do with a straight finger. That way you could adjust whether you're on or off axis.

The possibility of the whole thing moving up and/or side to side would seal the deal.
I bet people would pay for that!
Click to expand...

I actually offered a guy who works with animatronics 'ya know like Chuck E Cheese and Disney', $1000 to build be a remote mic stand that would move up/down/left/right/forward and back. I never heard back from him... :mad:

I would be interested if the appropriate movements were remotely controlled. Whether by cable or remote device from 20' through wall.
 
Actually, I can possibly see more application for this in a live setting rather than a studio.

The last live gig I did had a section where the same single stand mic in the middle of the stage was used by three different folks in succession--and one of them was about 5 ft. nothing while another was about 6 ft. 5 inches. Despite asking them/showing them/telling them about how to adjust the mic stand for themselves I don't think they got it right even once.

So, the servos would have to be quick and quiet enough for real time use (and cheap enough for real world use) but maybe...just maybe...
 
Vera' interesting!

How about mounting an extending boom assembly to a standard (but rugged) camera pan and tilt mechanism?
That would give you X Y and Z and if Y was quite a good range you might not need much in the way of up and down?

I can see that such a rig would be invaluable for wildlife recording if you wanted to get very close to very quiet sounds. Are the actuators waterproof?

Dave.
 
jimmys69 said:
I would be interested if the appropriate movements were remotely controlled. Whether by cable or remote device from 20' through wall.
Click to expand...

Hey Jimmy,

What kind of forward/backward movements are you talking? Myself and my colleagues here would be able to rig something up for you. We deal in actuators, so it's pretty much right up our alley. It could take a bit, because it will all be hand-crafted, but depending on how many actuators and motors are required (and the cost of the mic stand), it would take less than $1,000. I'd have to check into it, but if you're interested, we can talk more.
 
ecc83 said:
Vera' interesting!

Are the actuators waterproof?

Dave.
Click to expand...

The actuators are rated standard IP54. So, they're protected from water splashes, but there are boots that can provide extra protection. As well, these actuators can be customized for IP65, which would be greater protection. People use these actuators on boats and all that, so they're rated for that kind of use.

How big is the camera pan and tilt mechanism?
 
BroKen_H said:
What is in my head:

View attachment 89482

Rotating the boom would be a bonus, but not really necessary...
Click to expand...

I see what you're saying about the In/Out now. That's completely doable. The only thing I would be concerned about is the weight distribution along the boom when the actuator moves. But the large base may prevent anything from getting out of hand.

Rotating the boom would be the easier automation.
 
What about a 4th axis for the mic clip? The 3rd "fine manipulation axis will only go so far for adjusting the mic diaphragm to the source.
 
Webby McWeber said:
Hey Jimmy,

What kind of forward/backward movements are you talking? Myself and my colleagues here would be able to rig something up for you. We deal in actuators, so it's pretty much right up our alley. It could take a bit, because it will all be hand-crafted, but depending on how many actuators and motors are required (and the cost of the mic stand), it would take less than $1,000. I'd have to check into it, but if you're interested, we can talk more.
Click to expand...

I am only looking for guitar speaker cabinet mic adjustment remotely from my control room 20' or so from my tracking room. This would involve placement in front of a stationary speaker.

From a position with microphone placed directly in center of speaker cone: movement forward and back 12" total. Left/right movement 12" total (I am not so concerned with any tilt there with such a small range of movement needed). <that would not be so necessary for myself if up/down were also an option as you have already shown in your prototype.

I appreciate your honesty about cost. I actually just threw that number out to the guy/friend to hopefully get off his drunk ass and make me something. It just never worked out.

Seems like you have a better grip on reality as well as the resources to actually make it happen. I am more than willing to pay what is needed to make this come to fruition.

If needed and it helps, I can create demonstrations of the device in real world use.

Let's continue to discuss the possibilities here, but if we are going to talk directly about pricing and possible marketing we should speak via PM's about our personal endeavors. :)

Thanks McWeber! If that is indeed your real name..... :D

My name is Jimmy and gosh darn it-people like me. lol!
 
A possible much less expensive/bigger market might be to just build pieces for existing mic stands.

Say a small kick drum style mic stand: Create a device that connects to the boom arm as a mic would that has one ability. To move in or out. The same could be used with a straight stand for up/down movement. Another could be added to do the rotation of the stand.

A straight 'on axis' left/right would be the tough one to do as an ad-on to existing stands.

Then create a single device remote controller for budget versions, and a multiple device controller for users requiring multiple devices on the same stand.

Sounds like $$ to me. :)

I could see a semi pro home recording guy willing to spend $300 on one device. I sure would.
 
Webby McWeber said:
I see what you're saying about the In/Out now. That's completely doable. The only thing I would be concerned about is the weight distribution along the boom when the actuator moves. But the large base may prevent anything from getting out of hand.

Rotating the boom would be the easier automation.
Click to expand...

The OnStage Sounds unit I used as a demo is very stable with 2' movement of the boom, thus the 1' (allowing for some weight of the 3rd actuator), but has no easily rotatable part (the boom adjustment is welded directly to the top tube of the stand (which would, of course, be held in place by the first actuator.) The tip of the stand is actually a 12" third tube that can be moved. With the three movements, you'd be able to place a microphone ANYWHERE in a single plane (working with guitar cabs to hit the sweet spot on a speaker or just adjusting for different vocalists' heights). With a different mike stand that would allow a DC motor to rotate the boom, it could work well for finding sweet spots above or in front of drums, etc., but you'd have to be careful about weight distribution between the legs...man that sounds kinky, but I'm sure you understand what I mean.:o

jimmys69 said:
I am only looking for guitar speaker cabinet mic adjustment remotely from my control room 20' or so from my tracking room. This would involve placement in front of a stationary speaker.

From a position with microphone placed directly in center of speaker cone: movement forward and back 12" total. Left/right movement 12" total (I am not so concerned with any tilt there with such a small range of movement needed). <that would not be so necessary for myself if up/down were also an option as you have already shown in your prototype.

I appreciate your honesty about cost. I actually just threw that number out to the guy/friend to hopefully get off his drunk ass and make me something. It just never worked out.

Seems like you have a better grip on reality as well as the resources to actually make it happen. I am more than willing to pay what is needed to make this come to fruition.

If needed and it helps, I can create demonstrations of the device in real world use.

Let's continue to discuss the possibilities here, but if we are going to talk directly about pricing and possible marketing we should speak via PM's about our personal endeavors. :)

Thanks McWeber! If that is indeed your real name..... :D

My name is Jimmy and gosh darn it-people like me. lol!
Click to expand...

Hmmm. Sounds like someone who suggested that before knew the market :D a regular "marketing genius" :laughings:
And we really do like Jimmy...on his good days. :)
Just bear in mind, he has a LOT of good days!

jimmys69 said:
A possible much less expensive/bigger market might be to just build pieces for existing mic stands.

Say a small kick drum style mic stand: Create a device that connects to the boom arm as a mic would that has one ability. To move in or out. The same could be used with a straight stand for up/down movement. Another could be added to do the rotation of the stand.

A straight 'on axis' left/right would be the tough one to do as an ad-on to existing stands.

Then create a single device remote controller for budget versions, and a multiple device controller for users requiring multiple devices on the same stand.

Sounds like $$ to me. :)

I could see a semi pro home recording guy willing to spend $300 on one device. I sure would.
Click to expand...

Great idea. Now incorporate a kit that attaches to the stand and rotates the boom slowly (3 rpm 12vdc motor with a 12:1 gear ratio for 1/4 turn per minute/bi-directional control) and you've got a winner. Nice web site, some videos, advanced orders, Kickstart campaign. You're all set. Thank us monetarily when you make it big! :D
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top