Microphone for music and voice acting + audio interface

G

Grawlf

New member
Good evening. I am looking for a microphone that will do well with classical guitar and piano for the most part, though I will record steel-string guitar and possibly also vocals every once in a while as well. In addition to this, I will do voice acting in the not-so-distant future, and I may also be recording violin and oboe. The budget is around $200, but I live in Europe, so prices may be different from American websites.

Microphones I've been looking at include Audio-Technica AT2020, Røde NT1-A (it appears that it currently comes in a package that include pop filter, shock mount and other goods), and I guess I can't leave out Shure SM57.

Aside from a microphone, I will also be needing an audio interface. I take it that a computer sound card can't be used, but can an audio interface be used as a computer sound card? I have no idea how much money I need to put into an audio interface to get something decent, but let's say $200 and see where that gets me.

Lastly, I will be using a mac. GarageBand.
 
Grawlf said:
Good evening. I am looking for a microphone that will do well with classical guitar and piano for the most part, though I will record steel-string guitar and possibly also vocals every once in a while as well. In addition to this, I will do voice acting in the not-so-distant future, and I may also be recording violin and oboe. The budget is around $200, but I live in Europe, so prices may be different from American websites.

Microphones I've been looking at include Audio-Technica AT2020, Røde NT1-A (it appears that it currently comes in a package that include pop filter, shock mount and other goods), and I guess I can't leave out Shure SM57.

Aside from a microphone, I will also be needing an audio interface. I take it that a computer sound card can't be used, but can an audio interface be used as a computer sound card? I have no idea how much money I need to put into an audio interface to get something decent, but let's say $200 and see where that gets me.

Lastly, I will be using a mac. GarageBand.
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For that amount of variety I would definitely go for small diaphragm capacitors. The matched pair of Rode M5s look very good.

For a smell over $200 you will not beat the Native Instruments KA6 interface. If you must go lower. Steinberg UR22 or Focusrite 2i4.

Right! Kit sorted! Now go read all the stickies about recording room treatment!

Ah! Forgot the bit about a computer soundcard? Yes, the AI becomes the card (in fact often a good idea to turn off the infernal card, along with any computer bleeps. Don't know macs)
Nice thing about the KA6 is the big knob on top that give easy and precise output control, much like having a Monitor Controller as well.
Dave.
 
I may not have put enough emphasis on the first part. The vast majority of the recordings will be of classical guitar, with the piano not too far behind. The other usage areas I mentioned are a very small minority. I'm currently not sufficiently savvy on microphones, so can you elaborate? What makes Native Instruments KA6 such a good interface? Same with the microphones.

Alright, too bad, as I very recently bought an Asus Xonar DG.


On another note not directed at anyone, more input is appreciated.

EDIT: In case it affects anything, I recently bought a microphone stand. Ultimate Support Pro-T-T. Will I need another stand if I were to go for something like Røde M5?
 
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The Xonar is more of a gaming sound card, and won't give you the performance or features that you'll want for recording audio. Definitely check out the interfaces that ecc83 mentioned, they're all great pieces. Good preamps, multiple inputs/outputs, 1/4" and XLR jacks, phantom power, good routing options, direct monitoring, fast ASIO drivers for low latency. These are features that you'll soon find yourself lacking with a gaming sound card.
 
Exactly, I bought it because I was upgrading the audio on my computer, and it's a good sound card. Bought it along with some Beyerdynamic DT770 headphones. Not sure whether the audio interfaces here provide better sound quality in the computer card's own area, though, but it can't possibly be worse.

Any input on microphone?
 
When you get an audio interface, it will also be your computer's sound card. It'll be best to disable the Xonar altogether at that point.
 
Bump. I could still need some input here. Just to sum things up: I myself have been looking at microphones such as Audio-Technica AT2020, Røde NT1-A and Shure SM57.

Main usage areas: Classical guitar and piano. Very occasional uses: Vocals, and possibly voice-acting, violin, oboe.

Suggested microphones: Røde M5

Suggested audio interfaces: Native Instruments KA6 (Steinberg UR22, Focusrite 2i4)

Budget is around $200 per part. I live in Europe. I have a stand, Ultimate Support Pro-T-T.

Help is much appreciated.
 
All three of those mikes (especially the SM57) are great all around mikes. I have two 57s and use them for just about everything that my LDC won't cover well (voice and guitar body). Point the LDC at the body of the guitar (about the bridge @ 12") and the 57 at the 12th fret. Decent tones.
The stand won't make a difference, unless you get two mikes. 57's usually run around $100, so you might be able to hook into a cheaper LDC (I have the MXL 2001, and the 2006 is still available for about 80 quid from amazonuk). So, yeah if you get two mics, you'll need two stands.
The KA6 was my first choice in interface when I went to do my recent studio upgrade ($8k budget). So I won't argue with that choice. Great interface, flexible. I ended up going with the Tascam US1800 because it has more inputs, and I needed rackmount, but it is a bit less user friendly...meaning I loved the big knob!!!
What have you got for monitors? How is your room treated?
 
What exactly are the benefits of using two mics over one? Recording in stereo? Ideally, I want to run with one.

My room, and any room in the house, has standard treatment, that is no treatment specifically for sound. Currently, at least. I use a MacBook Air.


The country I live in is more expensive than most, so the cheapest I can get a Native Instruments KA6 online is $310~. Likewise, the cheapest Shure SM57, Audio-Technica AT2020 and Røde NT1-A go for ~$140, ~$145 and $245 (includes SM6 shockmount, pop filter, XLR cable, DVD and dust cover), respectively. Not including shipping costs.
 
Grawlf said:
What exactly are the benefits of using two mics over one? Recording in stereo? Ideally, I want to run with one.

My room, and any room in the house, has standard treatment, that is no treatment specifically for sound. Currently, at least. I use a MacBook Air.


The country I live in is more expensive than most, so the cheapest I can get a Native Instruments KA6 online is $310~. Likewise, the cheapest Shure SM57, Audio-Technica AT2020 and Røde NT1-A go for ~$140, ~$145 and $245 (includes SM6 shockmount, pop filter, XLR cable, DVD and dust cover), respectively. Not including shipping costs.
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I am confused here Grawlf! You are in Europe but quote prices in $$? Thomann have the KA6 at E225.

Mics, miccing and rooms! All about size really. Recording a really big instrument like a piano is very difficult with just one mic since no matter where you put it, one register of the strings is likely to dominate. Yes, you can back right off but then the room intrudes very badly. You would also struggle for level I would think with a dynamic.

Even for acoustic guitar, many people find they get a far better balance from a mic aimed at the 12th fret and one at the lower bout.
But mic technique is whole other, complex area and only practice will get results.

Stereo? I like it! You (and I!) are something of a minority here I would say in having most interest in "classical" music? Do not forget therefore that just about all the classical music (and broadcasts) you have ever heard have been in stereo.

I think the experts here (I am NOT one!) will all tell you that there is no single mic that can do it all. If all you did was sing and you can get the room right. SM58 or an LDC.
Just guitar amps? SM57. But for mixed (your!) usage my personal starter would always be a pair of SDCs and a stereo bar!

Rooms? A room of 80cu mtrs would be considered quite large here I would say but even so, "small" acoustically and in need of some treatment for recording.

Dave.
 
Not just stereo, but you get the option of "mix". When you mike drums, you can use few or many. Regardless, you can blend OH with snare and tom mics and get different tones and sounds by the use of that blend.
Same with guitar. Using two mikes allows you to "tune" the sound that you're getting somewhere between just the hole, and just the fret noise.
When in studio in the 80s, the piano we recorded on had 5 mikes on/under it and two room mikes. The tech listened to us and dialed in a tone that was really close to what we wanted and only needed minor tweaking to blend into our mix.
You can get great guitar sounds with only one mike. Play with placement until you get what you're looking for. Just remember that in an untreated room, the closer you get to the source, the less room you get. :D
 
The AT2020 is a decent SDC that has worked well for me as a general-purpose hammer. I'd pick a pair of those over either the SM57 or SM58 any day of the week, unless you're trying to do live sound reinforcement.

I think you'd be happy with a pair of either the AT2020 or the M5 for guitar, violin, oboe, piano, etc. With that said, I haven't used the Røde mics personally, so that last part is strictly hearsay.

What makes this challenging is that you're also trying to do voice recording. As a rule, large diaphragm mics aren't great for instrument work, and small diaphragm mics aren't particularly flattering for vocal work. I doubt you would like any of the mics you listed for voice with the possible exception of the NT1-A (which some folks like, and other folks don't). My first pick for vocals is either a CAD M9 or a ribbon. Ribbons are also great for brass.

Given that you're in Europe, I'd probably suggest one of Thomann's (passive) ribbon mics, e.g. the RB500. They're basically rebadged versions of the same mics we get here in the U.S. under brand names like Nady, etc. When coupled with an audio interface that has high-quality preamps, you can get great sound out of them. If you do this, though, be sure to get a pop filter and use it every time.

You could probably get away with using that in conjunction with an AT2020 for guitar work, too, so long as you're careful not to hit it. Even though its EQ curve isn't ideal for guitar, ribbon mics generally take EQ fairly well, so if you bump up the upper mids and highs, you should be in good shape. With that said, if you can get a matched pair of condensers plus a basic ribbon, you'll probably be happier.

I don't have any suggestions for audio interfaces, because I haven't shopped for those in a very long time. :)
 
ecc83: I quote prices in dollars brcause the vast majority of people on the Internet can relate to the dollar currency to at least some extent. $200 probably makes more sense to you than 1230 NOK.

I am obviously aware of the fact that there is no single mic that can do it all. The same applies almost everywhere else. Which is why I am looking for a mic that can do most things well enough, which again is why I stated what I am going to use it for. Come to think of it, I have a MIDI cable for the piano since it's a digital one, so I may possibly not need to use the mic there.


BroKen_H: That's a tad too much terminology. What do you mean by 'mix'?


dgatwood: Keep in mind that the guitar will be the main area. I'm not even sure if I will record the violin and oboe, at least not to begin with.


Just to reinforce a point here. I am more or less a complete newbie when it comes to recording. It feels like recording in stereo and all the work around it might be more complicated than necessary for someone at this stage. I like starting out with the basics and working my way up from there. That's why I wanted to start out with one mic, because it's easier to just have one to deal with. Regarding the wide variety of usage areas, I might just get another mic down the road to cover voice etc, if it's difficult to find a mic that won't completely butcher one usage area or the other.
 
Grawlf said:
ecc83: I quote prices in dollars brcause the vast majority of people on the Internet can relate to the dollar currency to at least some extent. $200 probably makes more sense to you than 1230 NOK.

I am obviously aware of the fact that there is no single mic that can do it all. The same applies almost everywhere else. Which is why I am looking for a mic that can do most things well enough, which again is why I stated what I am going to use it for. Come to think of it, I have a MIDI cable for the piano since it's a digital one, so I may possibly not need to use the mic there.


BroKen_H: That's a tad too much terminology. What do you mean by 'mix'?


dgatwood: Keep in mind that the guitar will be the main area. I'm not even sure if I will record the violin and oboe, at least not to begin with.


Just to reinforce a point here. I am more or less a complete newbie when it comes to recording. It feels like recording in stereo and all the work around it might be more complicated than necessary for someone at this stage. I like starting out with the basics and working my way up from there. That's why I wanted to start out with one mic, because it's easier to just have one to deal with. Regarding the wide variety of usage areas, I might just get another mic down the road to cover voice etc, if it's difficult to find a mic that won't completely butcher one usage area or the other.
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Ah! Norway! I see "Europe" and I think Euros! Yes, I agree dollars US is the best currency to quote in forums and I often do. It easy BTW to convert audio gear $USA to £Sterling...No change at all! We get shafted. Can you not buy from Thomann?

If there was a universal mic it would, IMHO, be the small diaphragm capacitor. Many say it is the perfect choice for acoustic guitar and it will do most other things pretty well.
I wish to offend no one but dynamics do have a limited bandwidth (their strength in many ways) and of course vastly lower sensitivity.

Dave.
 
But I will answer the question. Mix is the process of blending two distinct things into a totally different thing with options. For example, red and blue make purple, but different amounts of either color will yield different shades of purple. If you mix flour, sugar, milk, powder, eggs and vanilla you get cookies or possibly cake, pancakes or even biscuits depending on the blend you choose. You take two distinct sounds from two separate microphones and blend them on two tracks to get a mix of the two mics. A totally different audio "flavor" or "color" than either of the separate pieces that can be blended in different volumes from each to make different sounds to suit your "taste".
 
BroKen_H said:
But I will answer the question. Mix is the process of blending two distinct things into a totally different thing with options. For example, red and blue make purple, but different amounts of either color will yield different shades of purple. If you mix flour, sugar, milk, powder, eggs and vanilla you get cookies or possibly cake, pancakes or even biscuits depending on the blend you choose. You take two distinct sounds from two separate microphones and blend them on two tracks to get a mix of the two mics. A totally different audio "flavor" or "color" than either of the separate pieces that can be blended in different volumes from each to make different sounds to suit your "taste".
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What a brilliant analogy! And to push it even further...Once you have made your mix, like baking cakes, there is no way to get back to the original ingredients so ALWAYS make a backup of the (24 bit!) .wav track...Twice!

My son's stuff is spread over 4 hard drives. Two in 2 computers, one NAS and a USB 3.0 (well, just starting to BU in that one.)

Dave.
 
Steenamaroo said:
I'm sorry bro, but I'm going to make that my signature. :p
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Whoa, I'm honoured. Never had someone quote me in their signature before. Not entirely certain on what grounds, though—did I make myself seem like a fool?


ecc83 said:
Ah! Norway! I see "Europe" and I think Euros! Yes, I agree dollars US is the best currency to quote in forums and I often do. It easy BTW to convert audio gear $USA to £Sterling...No change at all! We get shafted. Can you not buy from Thomann?
Click to expand...
Would that I could. Everything Norwegians buy from abroad above 200 NOK ($30~), including delivery costs, is subjected to customs, and the additional costs can be quite ridiculous. Unless the difference in price in Norway and abroad is great, I will most likely save money buy placing the order in a Norwegian store.


BroKen_H said:
But I will answer the question. Mix is the process of blending two distinct things into a totally different thing with options. For example, red and blue make purple, but different amounts of either color will yield different shades of purple. If you mix flour, sugar, milk, powder, eggs and vanilla you get cookies or possibly cake, pancakes or even biscuits depending on the blend you choose. You take two distinct sounds from two separate microphones and blend them on two tracks to get a mix of the two mics. A totally different audio "flavor" or "color" than either of the separate pieces that can be blended in different volumes from each to make different sounds to suit your "taste".
Click to expand...
That's a very neat explanation. I suspected that's what you meant, but when you highlighted the word in quotation marks it made me somewhat uncertain.
 
I'm with ecc83. For your mix of work, go with a pair of small diaphragm condensers (yeah, yeah, I know Dave...they're really capacitors but calling them that just confuses people).

HERE'S a pair that sound good on guitar and also work quite well on voice...and are somewhere around your budget.

I can send you samples of both acoustic guitar and voice done on them if you want to hear what they sound like (but I better not post generally because they're not my copyright).
 
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