Micing a piano

Nik D

Another brick in the wall
I'm doing a demo for some friends of my friend. It's 2 girls, and piano. I'm planning on renting 2 - 4 channels of nice preamp, but I'm not sure on what to rent for the piano. Here's my setup, all signals will go into my laylas and get recorded on Nuendo. My mics that I already have are: several 57s, an Oktava 219 and 319, and some drumkit mics. I figure I could use the 319 for the vox, and was thinking perhaps some Neumann KSM 88s or something for piano. The piano is an upright, and I can move it around and take the front panels and top off.
 
hey michael. this is a Question for you... I read your post earlier and read that linked page.. VERY helpful stuff for me.. but I have a Question for ya...

I have a gig this weekend recording a 9 foot Grand in a fairly decent Recital Hall. This will be a soloist recording. The acoustics are great and I wonder if that's a bad thing for recording Piano...? Of course I could use blankets if need-be BUT what's your thoughts? ALSO I'd like to know what you think about mic selection.. I'm thinking of using the "A" setup with a "B" position mic for extra help in the mix.

Here's what I have access to:

1) 2 Behringer ECM 8000's - Electret condensor - omni
2) 2 Sennheiser's ??? - SD condensor - Super Cardioid
3) 2 Rode NT-3's - SD condensor - cardioid
4) 3 SM58 Knockoff's
5) 1 MXL V63 - LD Condensor - cardioid
6) 1 Cascade M20 - LD Condensor - cardioid
7) a few PZM's.. not too sure of the make/model

...As illustrated on the website you listed...
My thoughts are to use the NT3's in the "A" setup and use my V63 in th B"position" or the cadence depending on which I think sounds better on the grand..
I'm also thinking that maybe I could use both the LD's one in the "B" position and one in the "D" position. these would be in addition to the two mics in the "A" setup/position that I mentioned already.

What do you think? should I use any of my other options instead of the choices I presented?
I am eager to hear what you or maybe someone like Harvey has to say about this.. of course anyone else who has recorded Grang Piano.. PLEASE do chime in..


Thanks in advance.
 
I've had the most success using an X/Y pair in position D. Position A, the most common according to that site, over-accentuated the hammer sound on my grand, which is already too bright for my tastes to begin with. Position C in the soundholes sounded horrid to me... maybe if it was used in combination with other mics to add something extra to play with in mixing it would be OK, but definitely not as the primary mics.

Of course, my grand isn't 9 feet long and it isn't in a concert hall, so YMMV. :)
 
Yeah, I agree with BD on position "A". Too much hammer noise.

ZP - Of the mics you have available, I would suggest trying the NT3's, although, I must conffess, I'm not familiar with them.

Harvey and LittleDog were "instrumental" (pun intended) in helping me get a really great sound from my grand.
There's a thread here:
https://homerecording.com/bbs/showthread.php?postid=444746#post444746
with pictures of the setup. The setup looks odd, but listen to the results!!
I would try to point the mics slightly off axis from the hammers too, just to reject any unwanted hammer noise.

If you're recording in a hall, and it has great acoustics, I would try to take advantage of that natural reverb the hall would surely offer.
To achieve that, I'd take that V63 and place it about 4' away and 3' above the "crook" or "bend" in the grand.
Remember though, this mike is to capture ambience and not necessarily the piano, so consider that when you blend it into the mix.

Unless you really want to accentuate the bass, I'd avoid miking the grand from the tail.

Hope that helps? I'd really suggest reading the entire thread I linked. Harvey's the master when it comes to this stuff, and I'd never have been able to get the sound I do if it weren't for his help.
 
Michael, I hope that you catch this post... anywhoo..
The Piano was a Steinway & Sons 9' Grand - Old as crap But VERY WELL maintained.
I ended up getting to the Hall and they had AT4041's and Senn. MD421's... To make a long story short, I used the 4041's in XY 12" above the strings and about a foot or more from the hammers - under the lid at Full stick. I've got pictures of the setup of course.. and the 421 at the end of the piano about 7 inches over the bass strings. VERY nice sound indeed... I want 4041's!.. But alas I am a Home Rec.'er... Someday Perhapse.. I can get MP3's up if you want to hear. Pictures will be available If anyone wants them also.

Peace,
 
... Oh yes.. Hammer noise was not a problem.. BUT the damper was... but mainly because the age of the piano.. and the kid playing was only 14... so no soft feet there!.. LOL....

Again, I think that the sound I got was quite nice and anyone interested is more than welcome to my documentation.
 
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