Maybe a ribbon mic is more suitable for my needs? (info inside)

M

MidoBan

New member
Hi, i'm looking for a vocal mic and the sound i'm really aiming for is something like James Taylor's old classics.

Now, i'm not talking about finding out JT's recording chain, or recording with tape, or anything like that.. I know they used very expensive equipment, and i know that the whole chain effects the tone. Please don't get into this because there are a million threads about it and those threads never end. Sorry for writing so much about this, its just that i wanna stay on topic. I know i can't match this sound with just a mic and audio interface, so i'm just trying to get closer to it within what i can afford.

Ok, now that that's out of the table, my plans until now were something like a Sure SM7, EV RE20, or maybe an AT condenser. But i recently read some stuff saying that ribbon mics have a more vintagy sound, low end, "dry" tone.. And it really sounds like what i'm looking for for that old JT sound style. I really don't want to end up with a mic with a crisp high end, and that "perfect" tone we hear in modern music so much (again, please don't say "tape" lol). I'm looking for this older "imperfect", you know, less clean tone. So i thought i'll ask you guys if maybe i should go for these ribbon mics instead for my needs.

The mic is gonna be plugged into a Saffire Pro 40 interface. I know, it's nothing comparing to the sound i described, but just wanna get closer to this sound with the mic selection. Budget is around 400$, share thoughts about the whole idea and specific mic recommendations if you can.

Thank you!
 
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moresound said:
I would go with the EV RE20
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Thanks, really considering this one.
Just wanna figure out weather this "ribbon=vintage sound" thing is correct (or at least what i call vintage).
Maybe i just misunderstood its sound (from reading articles).
 
Well, the SM7 is one of my favorite vocal mics of all time. It's one of the greats. And I have always felt that the sound was somewhat "ribbon-like." I'm less familiar with the RE20, but it seems like that one got used more on instruments than vocals when I was in a commercial studio. It is still a standard in radio broadcasting, from what I understand.

As for the ribbons, it is true that they have a "mellow, 'vintage'" tone. However, by "vintage," they mean the 1950s, not the 70's when JT was on the top of the charts. I suspect (but don't know for sure) that he was probably mic'd with a mellowish condenser, like a Neumann U47 or 67. Some ribbons also seem to work better for instruments with harsh transients (distorted elect guitars, violins, etc..). Most don't have enough high frequency action to be considered great vocal mics.

As always, it just comes down to a matter of personal taste.
 
Yeah ribbons are what I consider vintage, but unlike most hipsters who consider anything before 1995 vintage, I mean like 1930's / 1940's era. Pretty much everybody from the early 60s on were done with condensers, maybe ribbons on amps (I read that ribbons were used on Bruce and Clapton's amps for Disraeli Gears).

But yeah go with the SM7 or RE-20.
 
Well thanks guys, you helped me a lot! If i had the cash, i would get both the SM7 and a Cascade ribbon and sell one after a comparison, but for now it will be the SM7.
 
It just so happens that I'm planning on getting a pair of Fatheads very soon, so I'll be in a position to better compare them directly with the SM7 as a vocal mic. However, I'm not really planning on using them as a vocal mic, at least not on a regular basis. I'm seeing them more as an instrument mics, which is why I want a pair of them, for stereo recording.
 
Bassman Brad said:
It just so happens that I'm planning on getting a pair of Fatheads very soon, so I'll be in a position to better compare them directly with the SM7 as a vocal mic. However, I'm not really planning on using them as a vocal mic, at least not on a regular basis. I'm seeing them more as an instrument mics, which is why I want a pair of them, for stereo recording.
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Well there's still some time until i'm getting the mic, so if you can, it will help me a lot to hear a male vocal comparison when you get it..
 
I have a Cascade Fat Head II with an upgraded transformer. It is absolutely fantastic on guitar amps! Easily best guitar mic I have. Kinda sounds dull as a room mic for drums, and have had decent success on it for wind instruments. But on guitars....jesus! Nothing else in my locker compares.
 
MidoBan said:
Well there's still some time until i'm getting the mic, so if you can, it will help me a lot to hear a male vocal comparison when you get it..
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Well, I'm planning on ordering them within the next week or two. However, it might be awhile before I can properly evaluate it as a vocal mic. I've found that you can't evaluate something as critical as a vocal mic outside of the context of the sound you're going for on a particular song, and how the mic works with the rest of the signal chain. For example, the CAD M179 gets used as my vocal mic about 70-80% of the time, not so much because the mic itself is great, but because it gets along fabulously well with my favorite vocal compressor (a Rane DC24). It is the combination of the two that is just magical and usually gives it the edge. The SM7B, which gets used the rest of the time, would probably get picked a lot more if the rest of the signal chain better matched that mic. It sounds really good with my GA Pre73, but I think it really needs a compressor that is somewhat "cleaner" than the DC24, but still more colored than the RNC. I still need to do more experimentation to see if I can use the RNC to just knock some of the bigger transients off while tracking (since I like to compress very slightly during tracking vocals), and then try some of the plugin comps that I have available for coloration. So, sometimes the "best" vocal mic - even for one particular singer on one particular song - is simply the one that fits most synergistically with the rest of the vocal chain.

I'm likely to make some experimental vocal recordings with the Fatheads as soon as I get them. But there's no telling how long it might be before I get a chance to try them out with my various pres and compressors, and then record them into my DAW and experiment with how well they fit in a mix, using all the processing that I have available in the DAW. And, without that information, any feedback I might have about their suitability (or not) as a vocal mic would be pretty much useless.
 
My dad and I both have really mellow voices, he sounds a lot like Paul Simon. For that sort of folkish stuff old condensors do the trick. I use a NTK and it sounds good on both our voices, and most voices I try it on for that matter.
 
Bassman Brad said:
Well, I'm planning on ordering them within the next week or two. However, it might be awhile before I can properly evaluate it as a vocal mic. I've found that you can't evaluate something as critical as a vocal mic outside of the context of the sound you're going for on a particular song, and how the mic works with the rest of the signal chain. For example, the CAD M179 gets used as my vocal mic about 70-80% of the time, not so much because the mic itself is great, but because it gets along fabulously well with my favorite vocal compressor (a Rane DC24). It is the combination of the two that is just magical and usually gives it the edge. The SM7B, which gets used the rest of the time, would probably get picked a lot more if the rest of the signal chain better matched that mic. It sounds really good with my GA Pre73, but I think it really needs a compressor that is somewhat "cleaner" than the DC24, but still more colored than the RNC. I still need to do more experimentation to see if I can use the RNC to just knock some of the bigger transients off while tracking (since I like to compress very slightly during tracking vocals), and then try some of the plugin comps that I have available for coloration. So, sometimes the "best" vocal mic - even for one particular singer on one particular song - is simply the one that fits most synergistically with the rest of the vocal chain.

I'm likely to make some experimental vocal recordings with the Fatheads as soon as I get them. But there's no telling how long it might be before I get a chance to try them out with my various pres and compressors, and then record them into my DAW and experiment with how well they fit in a mix, using all the processing that I have available in the DAW. And, without that information, any feedback I might have about their suitability (or not) as a vocal mic would be pretty much useless.
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Yeh well that makes sense.. hope you'll like it :)
 
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