Cheaper SM57 type mic?

jeff0633

Member
Hi.

I just ordered a Fostex VF-160CD, and I am going to need some extra mics if I want to record bands in my area. I was thinking that I will need about four more SM57's. I then started thinking about the wallet, and I decided to ask here if there are any mic that could give me close to what the 57 cn do for less money. Around here, 57's go for around $75 bucks. Any mics in the $35-50 range that would give me close to the same as the 57?

I have two Marshall mXL 603's, one SM 58, and a Studio Projects C-1 for vocals. If i were going to record an entire band, I would need probably four mics for the drums, and one for the guitar, and one for the bass.

If I use my two 603 small condensers for overhead mics on drums, then I would need a 57 type for the kick, one for the snare, one for a bass amp, and one for a guitar amp. That's why I was thinking about four 57's.

Any ideas for a cheaper possibility would be helpfull. Some one a while back was telling me about some small condenser Behringer reference mics. Could these be used in this type situation, or would I need dynamic mics for kick, snare, bass and guitar amps?

Thanks for any help.

Jeff
 
Just get the real thing...

Here's an excellent quote from Fletcher (at Mercenary Audio) that pretty much sums it up -- he was talking about mic pres, but it applies to ALL recording gear:

Originally posted by Fletcher@mercenary.com
...it may be a bit pricey for where you are right now... but when you figure that it's a tool that will serve you faithfully for an entire career... and maintain the majority of the purchase price for years to come... it's a damn good value that will net you the immediate results you require, and long term results you don't know exist at the moment.
 
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One thing I gotta add, is that they won't necesarrily last forever. I had one fall from a mic stand, and the capsule broke off. It was shocking!

Anyway, you shoul be able to find used 57's in the $50 to $60 ballpark on ebay and in local shops. I'd also look at used EV dynamics in that range.

Really you don't need a mic for the bass. (at least in my experience DI is usually better and easier.)

For drums you could pull it off with the 2 603's as overheads, and the 58 on snare. All you'd really need is a kick mic. A 57 can cut it, but if you can float a used ATM HE 25 ?? (roughly $100), it will save you headaches.

In reality to record all those things I'd opt for one 57 (or comparable EV mic) and the kick mic.

-Jett
 
No disrespect intended, but . . .

If you consider $75 too much for a good mic, then you might want to consider getting out of recording altogether.

Bless your heart for turning over every stone and looking for a cheaper diamond in the rough, but I'm afraid the 57 is just that. Good luck.
 
I recommend that you ask around after a discontinued AKG mic,
D690. Guitar center still has a few kicking around. They were your basic $80 dynamic, but GC will do deals on these. I recently picked up a pair for $36 apiece, no shit. They have a little more high end detail (some ears would say "hyped") than the 57. I would consider 2 57's and 2 D690's. I actually prefer the AKG's on cabs (never tried bass- for that and kick I prefer AKG D112, but I would send the bass to the board and save the cost of another mic. Personally, I don't think the D690 (or the 57, for that matter) is a very good choice on kick, but either will work well for toms and snare. I agree with the 012's for overheads. You might want to consider a dedicated kick drum mic. Unfortunately, good ones are like $200. Favorites are the D112, Beta 52 and Audix D-4 or D-6, all similar in price. One cheap option is a drum kit pack such as those by CAD and Audix, which will get you 4 drum mics and mounts for about $160. These kits will also not contain a real dedicated kick mic. Personally, I recommend 2 D690's, 2 SM57's, and a real kick mic. I prefer D112, but that's personal, and any of them should work. Use the 012's for overheads and do bass by direct injection. Good luck-Richie
 
"If you consider $75 too much for a good mic, then you might want to consider getting out of recording altogether"

There's a pearl of wisdom......................... Not!!! :o

Just do the best you can with what you can afford. If you like it--and your mates like it---then who cares if it doens't live up the the Chessrock "Gold" standard. :D

In my approach--less is generally more. Fewer "good" mikes are better than more "crappy" ones.

-Jett
 
jet-rocker said:
who cares if it doens't live up the the Chessrock "Gold" standard. :D

I'd give the same advice to anyone telling me they would like to get a hold of some decent beer, yet are hoping to score something less than $12/case. :D

I would recommend that person not take up beer drinking! :D But if you consider $12/case to be "Gold Standard" . . . you might get lucky and find something decent for $10 ("Tin-foil Standard?") in a shady part of town, but then again, you might just find yourself out $10 and with a nasty case of the runs. Be my guest and try it out.
 
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chessrock said:
No disrespect intended, but . . .

If you consider $75 too much for a good mic, then you might want to consider getting out of recording altogether.
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I don't, nor did I say that I consider, 75 bucks "too much" for a good mic. If I had a thousand dollars extra, I wouldn't consider that too much for a great mic. The point is, I didn't want to spend 300 bucks for four mics, then come here and find out about some fine little mic that everyone says is just as good as a 57 and it only cost $35 bucks. I just spent $800 for a recorder, so I was trying to avoid forking out another 300.
 
In my neck of the woods you can get a case of Blatz for $9.89--bottled. (better than anything that's under $25 a case.)

If fact, far from causing me to 'give up' beer drinking, my consumption has steadily inscreased.

Plus think of all the extras you get with cheap beer--iron flakes from rusty metal vats. Mmmmmmmmmmm nutritious.

Blatz gets you just as drunk as fancy beer. And, unlike wine and hard liquor, expensive beer is just as likely to cause hangovers as the cheap stuff. Maybe if you sip, beer---but beer sipping is for little boys.

Tequilla--that's a different story.

-Jett
 
jeff0633 said:
The point is, I didn't want to spend 300 bucks for four mics, then come here and find out about some fine little mic that everyone says is just as good as a 57 and it only cost $35 bucks.

You know the saying "If it sounds too good to be true . . ."
 
jet-rocker said:
In my neck of the woods you can get a case of Blatz for $9.89--bottled.

No shit. That same case would probably cost $15 in Chicago. If I pass through Kentucky anytime soon, I know what I'll be bringing back with me ! :D
 
Actually, I believe my (give or take)$35 AKG's *are* just as good as a 57, although somewhat different. I use both happily. But can you *replace* an SM57?-no.-Richie
 
people get shit all ass-backwards. they always ask about what kind of recorder should i get, what kind of computer, what daw, console, blah blah blah. dude, your better off getting a 4 track with the same quality of an 8 track and buy a better mic. if your great recorder records shit then you got shit. one could argue the mic is the most important part of the signal chain. i would argue the engineer is the most important part of the signal chain. if people here think limitations are good then you should limit your track count which gets you a cheaper recorder and get better quality mics. your digital boss four-track is going to sound better with a good mic then your 8 track fostex with a crappy mic. like it or not once you get good at this craft you will find yourself and your engineering buddy's constantly talking about mics and mic pre's, what combinations you like and how you go about micing things. listen to early great jazz recordings. they were done not with the best recorders (some were pretty good) but the common thread you will find were great mics, great rooms, great musicians and good mic placement.
 
The only "just like a 57" mic you are going to encounter for under $75 is a used 57.

However, depending on perspective, better may be possible, and certainly some better bargains. Scour the usual sources of used mics for a month and you could easily get an EV RE-15 and an EV 635a/PL-5 for as much or less money as one 57, and those are great mics you'll keep around for a lifetime. Other good ones to keep an eye out for are the Beyer M-201, Beyer Soundstar (Mark I or Mark II), and the EV RE-10 and RE-16. AKG had some dynamics that go hyper cheap used like the D320 and D310. I own one of the two but it's been on loan for years, and I don't believe I'll ever get it back, so I can't tell you how good it is.

Bear
 
I've got a small box full of 57's, and I don't think I've paid more than $50 for any of them. I always find them cheap at the Music Go Round chain, especially if you search their website for store inventory across the country. Most individual stores will be happy to sell them mail order - see if there are a few sitting around at some store in the middle of nowhere, and you can get them cheap! As far as used mics go, I can almost always count on a beat up 57 to sound just fine. Always glue the plastic windscreens down!
 
sweetnubs said:
people get shit all ass-backwards. they always ask about what kind of recorder should i get, what kind of computer, what daw, console, blah blah blah. dude, your better off getting a 4 track with the same quality of an 8 track and buy a better mic. if your great recorder records shit then you got shit. one could argue the mic is the most important part of the signal chain. i would argue the engineer is the most important part of the signal chain. if people here think limitations are good then you should limit your track count which gets you a cheaper recorder and get better quality mics. your digital boss four-track is going to sound better with a good mic then your 8 track fostex with a crappy mic. like it or not once you get good at this craft you will find yourself and your engineering buddy's constantly talking about mics and mic pre's, what combinations you like and how you go about micing things. listen to early great jazz recordings. they were done not with the best recorders (some were pretty good) but the common thread you will find were great mics, great rooms, great musicians and good mic placement.
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Well, I like some of what you said, but to me, I thing you are wrong about what's the most important. I have been recording for about five years. I am thousands in debt on my credit cards from searching for what makes the most difference in getting a pro sound. My friend went through the same situation as me. He spent $1200 bucks on a Great River pre, and got himself a 4033 mic, and his recordings still sounded pretty bad. We started reading about sound absorption and bass traps. He sold his Great River and 4033. he bought two roominator kits, extra 4 inch studio foam, extra bass traps and fixed his room up for about $800 bucks. He then went and got a Studio projects C-1 fpr vocals and some SM57's, and a Mackie 1604 VLZ pro, and his recordings sounded TEN TIMES BETTER than they did with the 4033 through the Great River in a shitty room. To me, it's not even debatable what makes the most impact. A silent room, where low frequencies are absorbed as good as the high frequencies are, where there are no standing wavs, gives audio signals that sound as if they are coming out of nowhere. The sound appear inside your head if you are using headphones. They have a pristine quality to them. In a shitty room, it's as if you hear a trail of shit all the way back to where the sound came from. So, no disrespect intended, but in my short five years of experience, I have heard plenty of bad recordings made with fine mics and preamps, but in shitty recording spaces. I have heard recordings that blew me away that were done with cheap mice and preamps, but in good rooms. So, to me, that's what I have heard in my five years of recording. Maybe in the next five years, i'll learn a few more things, I hope.

Jeff
 
G'day Jeff.

SM57's are probably THE 'desert island' dynamic microphone. They will work on most things. Snares, toms, guitar amps... even raunchy bluesey type vocals. There are probably as many 57's floating around the world as there are 58's. You can't go wrong with a 57. I guarantee your album collection will be full of drums and guitars recorded with these critters. They are the first choice of many engineers even when they have access to mics that cost twenty times as much. If you can stretch it you are investing in mics that you will ALWAYS use AND can ALWAYS resell because there is ALWAYS a market for them. ;)

As far as the kick drum is concerned, a 57 will work but something like an Audio Technica ATM25 is more suitable.

Oh yeah... Ditto on the DI for the bass!

Cheers
 
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jeff0633 said:
Some one a while back was telling me about some small condenser Behringer reference mics. Could these be used in this type situation, or would I need dynamic mics for kick, snare, bass and guitar amps?

This is the ECM8000. They're omnidirectional, so I don't think it's what you want. Of what you're recording, I think you'd only want them as a drum overhead. You've already got that taken care of.

I still use the $35 mics that come with a "Sound Attidct" T-shirt on toms. But I don't drink Blatz anymore.;)
 
I don't know if it will be of any help but you could consider tearing out the usually thick foam inside the protection grill of the cheap SM58 imitations made by Behringer etc.

It makes a big difference on any "stage type" vocal mic, whether dynamic or condenser, and makes them more "instrumental" airy sounding.
 
The SM57 is probably the cheapest "industry standard" all-purpose microphone on the planet. There is nothing cheaper and "better." $75 is a cheap microphone, no matter how you figure it.

Don't fall in with the "just get what you can afford" crowd when you're already talking about sub-one-hundred dollar items. They're angry, and they'll spend a lot more in the long run. Been there, done that.

Now if you have specific reasons for needing microphones, then perhaps there ARE better choices for those particular applications that sell for the same or less than an SM57. If that's the case, then you need to ask those specific questions. If you just need good all-purpose dynamics that will *always* remain useful, then the SM57 is a choice that few people would turn their noses at.

Slackmaster 2000
 
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