What distinguishes a particular guitar's sound?

beaverbiscuit

New member
Okay, I've played guitar for a number of years, but I've never had the fortune to own a truly great one. In fact, I can't really say I've even played a great guitar (or I've forgotten if I have).

What I'd really like is if I could hear how some of the different "great" guitars sound in a side-by-side comparison — you know, to help hear the difference between, say, an LP and a 335 or a Strat and a PRS Custom 22, or whatever.

I know that there are dozens of recorded examples of these and other guitars played by big names, but I want to hear the basic tones of them without all the effects and processing. Unfortunately I live in a city in which the competing music stores don't have much in the way of variety (one carries Gibson stuff, the other carries Fender, and so on), so I can't do much on-the-spot listening.

Can anyone either point me to a website or maybe provide some short examples to help me understand a little better? I know I didn't provide a list yet; I wanted first to see if anyone can relate to my problem.

Thanks again, youse guys! :D :D :D
 
im not trying to be a smartass...but ...why would you want to judge guitars by recorded examples instead of going to some music stores and playing the examples yourself and judging by that.

their are 2 important factors that have 90% to do with a great guitar sound.

you left hand and your right hand.

there is no way you can judge a guitar in someone elses hands...play it yourself, then decide what is right for you.
 
jimistone said:
im not trying to be a smartass...but ...why would you want to judge guitars by recorded examples instead of going to some music stores and playing the examples yourself and judging by that.

their are 2 important factors that have 90% to do with a great guitar sound.

you left hand and your right hand.

there is no way you can judge a guitar in someone elses hands...play it yourself, then decide what is right for you.
Like I said, where I live the music stores don't carry enough different instruments to make any real comparisons. For example, I can't go to the place and try an LP followed by a Strat followed by a Parker and then a PRS. They simply don't have them.

I'm not trying to be lazy by asking this question, and I'm not stupid either. I realize that at some point I have to be able to play the instruments myself. And I know that the hands are key. It's just that everyone talks about the "classic LP tone" or whatever, so I was hoping for examples.

Anyway, forget I asked, y'all. I'll find out someday, if I ever get a chance to go to a larger store.

Sometimes it really sucks to live in Anytown, USA. . . .
 
Awww..... don't give up just yet.

You can make some general statements that distinguish certain guitars from others, but that's about it. There are just too many other factors: amps, fingers, recording technique, context, etc...Two guys who both play Strats may sound so different you might not even realize they both play strats. For example, Robert Cray compared to Hendrix. Or Zakk Wild to Duanne Alman (Les Pauls).

But generall speaking you can say this: most every solid-body electric guitar is descended from either a Les Paul or a Strat, or hybrid of both.

These are my main three headings:

Fender Strat: Thinner, glassier tone, mainly due to the single coil pickups, and light alder body. Bolt on neck. Generally a weaker signal, which lends itself to clean rythms and funky licks. Almost a quacky tone in certain pickup combinations, snappy tone in others. Overdriven it usually tends to sound more "open" than other designs. Examples: Strat, Tele, Ernie Ball Sillhouette, Don Grosh, G&L, etc......Listen to: Hendrix, later Clapton, SRV, country guitar.

Gibson Les Paul: Fatter darker tone, mainly due to the humbucking pickups, heavy mahogany body. Neck through body. Generally louder, with more push. Examples: Gibson Les Paul, SG, PRS, etc. Listen to Zakk Wyld, Duane Alman, early Clapton, etc.

The Van Halen hybrid: A Strat syled, bolt on neck guitar with humbucking pickups. These have the volume and push of a Gibson style guitar, with the brighter sound of a lighter bodied Strat. Generally speaking, these are hard rock guitars. Examples: Ibanez, Kramer, Jackson, etc. Listen to: EVH, Satriani, Steve Vai.

Outside of those guidelines, just listening will do you no good. To discover the more subtle differences you will have to start judging guitars on an axe by axe basis when you play them.

good luck,

Aaron
http://www.voodoovibe.com
 
well, just me personally.........

i would NEVER buy a guitar sight un-heard, unless they had a good return policy (like Carvin, one of which i did purchase).......

here's the deal.

if you COULD go into a dealership, and play, say, 14 fender stratocasters, every single one of them will sound a LITTLE bit different........

there's so much voodoo involved in what makes a guitar sound good........

the luthier
the type of wood
the age of the wood
the density of the wood
the moisture content of the wood
whether the wood came from a tree that was north facing or east facing........;)
all of that.

then you get into the electronics, another voodoo area.

some say the only way you can tell how an electric guitar is going to sound is to plug it into the rig you plan to use.....

others say you know by listening to it acoustically (this was how stevie ray vaughan supposedly selected his main tobacco burst strat........)

same with a paul, or a ric, or a schecter, or a parker..... all of em.

there's no one thing you are going to be able to read and understand, that will help you make a selection.

you gotta play it.
 
What Aaron said.

It's all about the player. The guitar does have some say in the sound, but consider this:

Jimmy Page (e.g. early Led Zep) and Vince Gill (e.g. Liza Jane, Oklahoma Borderline) - both Telecasters.

Mark Knopfler (e.g. Telegraph Road, Sultans of Swing etc.) and Stevie Ray Vaughn (all of it) - both Stratocasters

Les Paul and Billy Gibbons both play Les Pauls
Les Paul guitars were originally designed as jazz guitars by Les Paul - a jazz player. Until M. Bloomfield (over here) and E. Clapton (over there) got their hands on one.

ES 335/355 BB King and Larry Carlton (e.g. Steely Dan - Kid Charlemagne solo)

Not much help is it?

foo
 
Aaron and GONZO-X pretty much nailed it....wood and electronics make big differences...other differences are made by height of strings (action) and hardware such as tuners, nuts, saddles, bridges, frets, etc.......the set up of a guitar involves all the hardware thingys, and a poorly set up guitar is a poorly sounding guitar, no matter how much it cost......a good set up is money well spent....and if you can do it yerself, even better....I can half-ass do most of a set up on my own stuff, but I don't mess with fret filing, nut grooves, etc.....what can I say, I'm a wuss, and I'd rather pay a few bucks to somebody to improve what I can't....

I do agree with foo about it sorta being all about the player, but keep in mind, those guys listed played some very nice models of guitars, plus the set ups of their guitars were A plus.....a good example of it "all being about the player" is that folks are still debating whether or not Page played a Tele or a Les Paul on the second album........some people have said he can make ANY guitar sound like a Les Paul, which is certainly possible, considering other factors, mainly amps...also pedals to a large degree.....he honed in to his own sound, and although he may not be the most technically proficient player, he does have a
sound/tone that is killer........to my ears anyway......gibs
 
Re: Re: well, just me personally.........

Buck62 said:


Stevie Ray played a Tokai Springy Sound, NOT a Stratocaster.

Read this...
http://www.flyingvintage.com/gcmag/srv.html

Buck, are you suggesting that SRV's beat up old guitar was not a Fender? Yes, Stevie did endorse Tokai guitars for a little while in the 80s and I'm sure he owned a few that were used as back ups, but not his number 1 guitar.
 
I suppose we all have a unique answer to this question. For that matter so will the manufacturers. Notice when you read the promotions for any product in the world the manufacturer tauts "the best and smoothest, richest creamiest" and so on. Just like all the boys said, the quality of the materials will have a dramatic effect on the tone and sound of each guitar. Different woods resonate differently. however in this day and age of processors and modlers all the tonal quality issues become a bit less of an issue. Most modling machines for example, modify and alter the signal that is introduced. To a point it almost does not matter what guitar is plugged into any number of rigs because with a few twists of knobs or tweaks of buttons a desired tone can be duplicated.
Be that as it may, I think the impacting benefit of a top quality guitar will be seen in its playability. Just like the features on a new car. A basic off the lot car is going to get yu to work and back with a certain amount of reliability. Add the power this and power that and the ride becomes smoother and maybe faster and so on.
Top end guitars are going to have smoother necks... which result in smoother or faster playing, less fatigue. Better electronics that pick up specific ranges of picking. Perhaps a "brighter" neck that offers better sustain. This goes for the saddles and nuts as well. Smoother tuners. Bottom line is that the higher end guitars make it easier and more enjoyable for playing long term.
I have no oubt that theres plenty of fellows here who will argue with me, and frankly personal preferance has a lot to do with this issue. Craftmanship effecting a guitars tone is a reality, but more so with acoustic guitars in my opinion.
 
Re: Re: well, just me personally.........

Buck62 said:


Stevie Ray played a Tokai Springy Sound, NOT a Stratocaster.

Read this...
http://www.flyingvintage.com/gcmag/srv.html

Nope...
From http://www.rockthehouse.org/
In the summer of 1973, Stevie Ray walked into Ray Hennig's Heart Of Texas Music store and found his Pride and Joy, a 1959 Fender Stratocaster.

"I didn't even have to play it- I just knew by the way it looked that it would sound great. I was carrying my '63 Strat, and asked if he wanted to trade. Thank God he did, and it's been my main axe ever since. The guitar was officially put out in 1962, but the neck has a '59 stamp on it. There was also a sticker under the bass pickup that read 'L.F. '59'. I think Leo Fender put it together with spare parts and issued it in '62. But to me it doesn't really matter; all I know is I've never found another one like it. The neck is shaped differently from the others. It's a D-neck, but it's oddly shaped- it's real, real big, and fits my hand like a glove."

From the SRV Faq
"NUMBER ONE"

"Number One", also called "First Wife" is the beat-up mongrel Strat that we all know and love. Constructed of a 1959 body, and (originally) a 1962 neck, it possessed a deep, dark growl of a tone that was immediately identifiable. Even though it used all "stock" Fender Strat parts, about the only "original equipment" parts it possessed by 1990 were the body and the pickups. Over the years, Stevie and Rene Martinez, his guitar tech, replaced the pickguard, vibrato unit, saddles and neck. Some modifications were purely cosmetic, some were functional (to derive a particular feel or tone), and others were out-and-out repairs.

Number One was obtained in 1973 in a trade-in of his first Strat, the 1963 he purchased in 1969. According to Stevie, he saw the Strat in Ray Hennig's Heart of Texas Music, in Austin. He said he knew that this tobacco-sunburst, used Strat was, just by looking at it, the guitar for him. The neck was an oddly-shaped rosewood D-neck, very large, which fit Stevie's large hands like a glove. The body was stamped "LF-1959", but the neck was stamped "1962". Stevie surmised that Leo Fender probably assembled this guitar from left-over 1959 production parts in 1962. It was rumored that the "LF-1959" actually meant "Louis Fuentes" and not Leo Fender. Neither was ever truly verified.

In interviews, Rene sometimes took issue as to the date of manufacture of Number One. Rene claims he has found that the pickups are 1959, while both the neck and body are 1961. In Stevie's mind, the guitar was a factory-cobbled-up 1959, so all discussion ended there.

The guitar originally came with a stock, early-sixties style white pickguard, a right-handed vibrato unit, and 1959 pickups. It is rumored that sometime during the life of the guitar, either Stevie or a previous owner had the pickups rewound at the Fender factory. The result was a slight overwind from original, which is duplicated in the SRV Signature Strat. I cannot find proof of the pickup rewind.

Over the years, Stevie replaced the pickguard (several times) with a black pickguard and added his "SRV" initials in iridescent lettering of several styles. Rene Martinez remarked that he would prowl truck stops to obtain letters to replace the ones that wore away. Eventually the iridescent "SRV" was replaced by Letraset script-style lettering, first seen during his appearance on the "Tonight Show" in 1989. This show introduced the SRV Signature Strat prototype. Stevie was to play this prototype, but it did not sport his trademark initials. The "Tonight Show" art department came up with this new lettering style at the last minute. These script letters are what is engraved in outline form on the SRV Sig Strat.

The vibrato was replaced with a gold left-handed unit sometime around 1977. This was the beginning of Stevie's "Hendrix period". Since Jimi Hendrix and Otis Rush played a right-handed guitar turned "upside down", therefore putting the vibrato bar on top, Stevie emulated this by installing a left-handed vibrato unit in Number One. He also felt it gave him better access to the bar, but did remark that several times, during especially manic performances, it fairly well tore half his sleeve off when he got caught-up on it. Stevie normally used four or five springs in this unit, and had the pivot plate pulled tight against the body. This meant he could only push the bar, and not pull up on it.

Another significant change from stock were the installation of jumbo bass-style frets. This added to the sustain, and gave Stevie added ability to bend the strings with the enormous strings that he used. He gradually went to smaller strings as he got older, but they were still heavy by modern standards. His string sizes in 1984 were generally .013, .015-.016, .019, .028, .038, and .056-.060. In the 1970s, his high E string would sometimes go as high as a .018! By the time 1989 rolled around, Rene convinced him to use a .011 or .012 to save his fingers. His fingers would get torn up so badly that he would actually use super glue to re-attach torn callouses.

The finish of Number One became progressively more beaten up as the years went by. Stevie would pound, scrape, kick, stand on, and otherwise torture the guitar during his performances. Eventually it developed a quarter-inch gouge just above the pickguard where Stevie's manic strumming continually bashed it. There probably was not a square inch of lacquer remaining by 1990. That certainly did not detract from the wonderful sounds it made.

It is not known when the original neck was replaced. Number One had many repairs throughout Stevie's career. An early mishap can be seen on the liner photos for the IN THE BEGINNING album. Stevie had watched how his brother Jimmie would bounce his guitar off the wall, and he thought it was a cool trick. During an early performance of "Third Stone From the Sun", he recalled, he tossed Number One a little too hard. It hit the wall at a bad angle, and severely split the headstock. The photos in the album show the taped-up headstock. Either Rene Martinez or Charley Wirz eventually repaired this damage, as Rene has said that Stevie used the original neck until 1989.

Stevie briefly considered retiring Number One by late 1989, when the neck became unusable. It had gone through so many re-frets and repairs that it just could not hold another re-fret, and its playability was near impossible. So, Rene swapped the neck from "Scotch", a 1963 Strat, onto Number One. This was the neck that was snapped on July 9, 1990 at the Garden State Art Center in New Jersey, when a heavy piece of stage scenery fell on several guitars. This prompted Stevie to beg Rene to try and get one more life out of the old neck. Rene ended up ordering a replacement vintage neck directly from Fender, and received (according to Rene) a 1963 copy, similar to what was destroyed in the accident. Stevie was without Number One for only one show.

Number One was originally rumored to be buried with Stevie at Laurel Land Cemetery, near Dallas. Current reports indicate that Number One actually "resides" with one of the Vaughan family members, either Jimmie or his mother. Rene Martinez swapped the original neck back onto Number One and gave it to the Vaughan family.
 
Once more, with feeling

Okay, thanks again for the input. And my apologies to jimistone if I offended you; I was at low ebb when I replied earlier, and it seemed to me at the time that your answer was kind of like "Get over it." I shouldn't reply to posts when I'm off kilter.

That said, it seems that "Get over it" really _is_ the answer, in a way, eh? And I think Even may have struck a chord (oh, the humanity!) with the comment about playability. I certainly don't have an amp I'd care to record, so I'll be forced to use simulation/modeling for a while. If so, the playability thing looms large, I would think.

Which reminds me of a rig I used to have — the old ADA MP-1 preamp and MIDI controller. Anyone know why these lost favor? From what I remember, it _did_ provide a lot of good tones back in the day, but it's been a while so I could be in the grip of a false memory. :D :D :p :D :D

Thanks, y'all!
 
cool thread..... AND GREAT POST BDGR !

so, i guess that means that you can buy a guitar on sight/unheard !!!

LOL

well, you could put piano wire on a broom stick, and SRV would have made it sound soulful..........

a good example of it not really mattering which guitar you play, could be eddie van halen playing "Spanish Fly" on a nylon-stringed acoustic.......

sounds just like eddie.........
 
Nobody said sight/sound unheard. Issues came up that suggested several factors to consider in addition to the "tone". Weight, action, knob position. Tuning keys left or right? Body shape (in both size and resonation issues), nut/saddle composition, pickup configuration. Neck width...
 
hey even.................

even said:
Nobody said sight/sound unheard.

well i did, if you read my post..............
"well, just me personally.........
i would NEVER buy a guitar sight un-heard"


was that a knee jerk reaction?:D
 
Re: hey even.................

GONZO-X said:
even said:


well i did, if you read my post..............
"well, just me personally.........
i would NEVER buy a guitar sight un-heard"


was that a knee jerk reaction?:D
I think Even was referring to my original post, because I never once said anything about purchasing a guitar. I was trying to find out the information, but not for the purpose of buying a guitar (at least not right now). I don't know of too many players who have played 10+ years who would buy a guitar without playing it, and that group includes me.

Correct me if I'm wrong, Even, but I believe he thought that you were making an assumption, Gonzo-X. And of course when you do that you make an ass out of you and umption. :D :D :p :D :D (Sorry, couldn't resist — it's my favorite line from *The Long Kiss Goodnight*. Mmmmm — Geena Davis.)
 
beaverbiscuit

i believe, when you make a response to a post, you are including all in the conversation.

i also believe i was correct in retorting, because, as i said before, i had mentioned "sight/unheard", therefore making the statement relevant.

the whole point of the reply was to help you.

there's a wealth of information out there.......

but only for those who seek it.

Okay, I've played guitar for a number of years, but I've never had the fortune to own a truly great one. In fact, I can't really say I've even played a great guitar

i believe this statment leads one to believe that, if you did have the funds, and the knowledge, you would possibly purchase another guitar.

and i have, in the past, purchased a guitar sight unheard, and it really worked out for me.

and i did so knowing the things i already tried to lay out for you as generally as possible.

You'll be hard pressed to find a guitarist that is worth his salt, tell you it is not important to play every guitar that interests you, to determine what makes it sound the way it does.....

you asked about websites.

if you go here, you can read reviews from users, on just about every electric guitar out there.
http://www.harmony-central.com/


pickups make a difference......
http://www.billlawrence.com/

http://www.guitarnuts.com/

then try these............because the amp is relevant too........
http://www.amptone.com/index.html
http://www.firebottle.com/ampage/
 
For the record: My responce and two cents was typed in an effort to answer the specific thread starters post. I confess that I did not read everyones post with the thouroughness that they each deserved. My primary intent was to simply say theres alot of things about a guitar that will effect how it plays and sounds. My second post "no one said" was obviously an error, as it appears someone did "say". Be that as it may, I was throwing out options to the base question and hope no follow up posters feel hurt or left out.
 
Re: beaverbiscuit

GONZO-X said:
i believe, when you make a response to a post, you are including all in the conversation.
I disagree, but I think I see what you're saying.

i also believe i was correct in retorting, because, as i said before, i had mentioned "sight/unheard", therefore making the statement relevant.
Yes, but from my perspective it seemed to be a comment out of context of the original question, that's all.

the whole point of the reply was to help you.

there's a wealth of information out there.......

but only for those who seek it.


(beaverbiscuit said) Okay, I've played guitar for a number of years, but I've never had the fortune to own a truly great one. In fact, I can't really say I've even played a great guitar.

i believe this statment leads one to believe that, if you did have the funds, and the knowledge, you would possibly purchase another guitar.
Interesting that you reached that conclusion, since it could be said about virtually anyone who plays guitar regardless of such a statement. Gear sluts that we all are, right? :D

and i have, in the past, purchased a guitar sight unheard, and it really worked out for me.

and i did so knowing the things i already tried to lay out for you as generally as possible.

You'll be hard pressed to find a guitarist that is worth his salt, tell you it is not important to play every guitar that interests you, to determine what makes it sound the way it does.....
Maybe I'm not interpreting your tone correctly, but these comments along with your earlier comment about "there's a wealth of information out there. . . but only for those who seek it" seem to indicate that you don't much of how I'm going about finding the information I want. Let me say again — I don't have immediate access to the instruments I want to try, and I haven't turned up anything thus far searching the web. That's why I came here with my question in the first place.

you asked about websites.

if you go here, you can read reviews from users, on just about every electric guitar out there.
http://www.harmony-central.com/


pickups make a difference......
http://www.billlawrence.com/

http://www.guitarnuts.com/

then try these............because the amp is relevant too........
http://www.amptone.com/index.html
http://www.firebottle.com/ampage/
Thanks for the links; I'm sure they'll come in handy.

Peace out! ;)
 
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