importance of multiple overhead mics

And one great mic will always trump two mediocre mics when it comes to sound quality.

The right mic for the source/application will always trump the wrong mic for the source/application, and the right mic isn't always the most expensive or most impressive looking. There are many sources and applications for which several mediocre mics will be preferable to one fancy one. A rock drum kit is one of those sources/applications where that's especially true.
 
It's a legit and alternative third way to upgrade.
Stereo does not not necessarily translate into great sound.
And one great mic will always trump two mediocre mics when it comes to sound quality.
If you can't even get great mono, why bother with stereo?

Agreed, stereo does not necessarily translate into great sound.

The completely wrong statement that one 'great mic will always trump two mediocre mics' is just bad advice.

Sorry man, not gonna let that slide.

If you can't get something to sound good in mono? Give up or try something new. But that don't mean you would not benefit from two mics.

Jeez....
 
OPs question was:
Basically I want to know if stereo overheads are a prerequisite to producing hi-fi recordings, or if they can be pulled off with a mono, if other factors pick up the slack.

Short answer:
You can get great drum sounds in mono.
What is wrong with that in your opinion?
Care to explain?

Or do you just want to display a general douchebaggery, instead of giving good advice?
 
OPs question was:


Short answer:
You can get great drum sounds in mono.
What is wrong with that in your opinion?
Care to explain?

Or do you just want to display a general douchebaggery, instead of giving good advice?

Are you here to help or call people douchebags? Please answer honestly.


There is nothing wrong with your opinion. It was your statement that was incorrect.

Please, we have too many trolls here already. Try not to be a dick to other members unless your advice is sound. Or at least put in there a simple "In My Opinion".

Newbies see posts like yours and may assume that one good condenser mic will sound better than two cheap ones. That just isn't true in the real world.

The mic/s for any particular purpose is dependent upon it's source and situation.

Boulder has it right.
 
You can get great drum sounds in mono.
What is wrong with that in your opinion?
Care to explain?

Or do you just want to display a general douchebaggery, instead of giving good advice?

You didn't just suggest mono drums, you suggested using only two mics on the kit. That may be fine for some types of music, but for most applications you need more mics on the kit. The OP is clearly not going to quit using close mics, nor should he.
 
And this guy clearly wants to use stereo overheads to get what he feels will be a better sound. Telling him to dump everything for one mic is retarded.
 
Are you here to help or call people douchebags? Please answer honestly.
Both, if I can get away with it.:)
I replied when only your facepalm reactions were online, and they were neither helpful nor excessively polite either.


Newbies see posts like yours and may assume that one good condenser mic will sound better than two cheap ones. That just isn't true in the real world.

The mic/s for any particular purpose is dependent upon it's source and situation.

Boulder has it right.

I don't claim to speak teh gospel.
But I really do think that using one good mic is always better than using two cheap ones.
btw, I'm not saying expensive trumps cheap, or that cheap always equals bad.
All I'm saying is better always trumps good or mediocre.
 
But I really do think that using one good mic is always better than using two cheap ones.
btw, I'm not saying expensive trumps cheap, or that cheap always equals bad.
All I'm saying is better always trumps good or mediocre.

The first sentence contrasts "good" with "cheap", clearly implying that cheap is bad. The way you use "better", "good" and "mediocre" imply that they are absolutes rather than being relative to the source/application.

If you think using one mic is always better, why did you suggest using a separate kick mic? Do you practice what you preach, using only one mic for all sources? Is that how you record a whole band, one mic in the room?
 
I've been using mediocre mics to record my kid's drumming, including a pair of stereo overheads, and making a bit of a hash of it.

Recently, using the same mics, I made a much much better recording simply by treating the room and making sure the mics were placed correctly. In this instance, the quality of the mics was of far less importance than how they were used, and what was done to improve the sound source.
 
By the way, Ibleedburgundy... $700 for a mic? Jesus! I hope it came with a Fiero or something. :)

Come to Australia when the AUD was low... I paid $1800 for a AKG 414, $850 for a 451, $800 for a Rode NT2, $600 for Rode NT5 pair... that's just what they cost

IBB's Neumann has a RRP of $1150 right here right now, with a relatively strong AUD, but you can get it for $799... cry me a river!:laughings:

Mind you we earn more than $5 an hour here..:eek:
 
I don't claim to speak teh gospel.
But I really do think that using one good mic is always better than using two cheap ones.
btw, I'm not saying expensive trumps cheap, or that cheap always equals bad.
All I'm saying is better always trumps good or mediocre.

I disagree with that statement. I have owned a set of Shure SM81's along with a single Neumann KM84. The SM81's saw a lot more use on overheads, the Neumann is certainly a better mic but stereo image is a nice thing to have.
 
The first sentence contrasts "good" with "cheap", clearly implying that cheap is bad. The way you use "better", "good" and "mediocre" imply that they are absolutes rather than being relative to the source/application.

I should have stuck closer to the OPs naming, with "average" and "good" mics.
So, read cheap as average and you get the idea.
And with "good" I mean something like "holy cow, this thing sounds good on just about anything".
And yes. I believe that there are mics out there that work absolutely better than most other mics on most sources for a given recordist.
Which mic that is is down to personal preference, though, and depends on workflow and taste.
Find the thing that works for you and be done with it.

If you think using one mic is always better, why did you suggest using a separate kick mic? Do you practice what you preach, using only one mic for all sources? Is that how you record a whole band, one mic in the room?

One good (look above), well placed overhead will already give you a nice representation of the whole kit, if done right (and if you have a good drummer).
The kick could use a little help in most cases, though, I don't think you will disagree on that?
Remember, the OP asked for High Fidelity,
not for endless options in mangling and sample replacement, so he is clearly not gonna do metal.
And in my experience it is most often a good idea to forego the nightmare of phasey shit that a pile of average (or below average) mics on a drumset is, weird off axis response and all, from a fidelity POV.

For the music I make one good overhead and a kick mic is sufficent for drums.
So I'd settle for a nice LDC, like a Brauner Phantom Classic, or the like, (which I would rent, if I needed it on just the one gig, and buy, if it will pay for itself in the future) and Beyer M88's for everything else, as they work for me reliably good as kick, amp (b, g, keys), and vocal mic and they are even doing well on acoustic instruments. For vocal overdubs I could as well use the LDC if it outperforms the M88 which might be or might not be the case, depending on the singer.

So, yes. I would definitely sell anything that I do not really need and buy the best single mic I can afford.
A small selection of good gear makes recording much easier than a lot of average gear, in my experience.
Now facepalm on, if you need to.
Over and out.
 
Oh, I agree you can capture the kit with one "good" overhead and a kick. I've done it. It helps to have a space that doesn't suck.

Yes, phase issues... But those can be managed. The payoffs are more control in mixdown and stereo image. I'm not into toms coming from opposite sides of the room, but I do think some stereo dimension in the drums adds a lot to a rock mix.

Anyway, the original question was about upgrading overheads to stereo vs. upgrading the quality of close mics. I say go stereo.
 
I have broken up with multiple girlfriends who "grew as a person".

That sounds like something I would say. I knew there was a reason I liked you. :)

Since I've learned a lot from people on this site and given back little but bad humor and sound quality reviews with an acuity not much better than what Helen Keller could have done, once my overheads come in the mail, I'll record a quick "pepsi challenge" consisting of 30 seconds of drumming with my old setup, then hook up the new setup with the stereo overheads, do all I can to get the best sound out of them (move them around, use different EQing, etc), play the same thing and record it, stick them on the same track and post them.

I don't know how useful it will be, but it will make me feel like I've "given back" a bit. Like when a guy leaves the ghetto, becomes a star in the NFL and gets rich, then pisses away all his cash by giving it to his buddies that he grew up with.

I guess it's actually nothing like that, but when you watch at least an hour of ESPN (which has sucked for years, but I still watch for some reason) a day, this is the kind of thing you associate with the phrase "giving back". :)
 
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