The Fake Drums Tone Thread

Man, That is some complicated shit!
It would take me half a decade to get the drums down on a song like this.
My hat is off to you miner!
You're obviously a bona fide genius.

Lol...thanks Jimi, but I'm definitely not a genius man, I'm just a hack that has turned into a computer geek over the last few years...

So, I took Greg's suggestions (lower the toms in their own channel, raise 'em in the oh's, & widen 'em a little), & here's the result...Dunno if it's much better or not, I probably still need to mess with the levels, but I tried to do what was suggested, without fucking the whole thing up...:)

Lemme know if this is any better:

Dr. Love 2
 
I think that those sound really good, miner. To my ears, those are really convincing drum sounds.

Cool technique, extracting MIDI data from the multi-tracks and using it to trigger samples. I've seen Warren Huart do something similar when mixing drums, when he wants to mix in samples to beef up the existing drum sounds.
 
I think that those sound really good, miner. To my ears, those are really convincing drum sounds.

Thanks man, I spend a lot of time (too much...lol) on these fake drums, but I'm getting better at it (or I hope...ha!!), & I'm getting there a little quicker too, so I'm more than happy when folks tell me they sound pretty convincing...Thanks again dude!!!

Cool technique, extracting MIDI data from the multi-tracks and using it to trigger samples. I've seen Warren Huart do something similar when mixing drums, when he wants to mix in samples to beef up the existing drum sounds.

That's something I've been trying to do for years man, & I've tried all kinds of stuff, but for me the script a guy in the Reaper forum made works better than anything, & it's free...

The big drawback/hassle for me is getting the tempo map right, so the midi plays/triggers like it should, & follows the click track, but I'm getting better at that too...

I actually mixed an ep for a band a few years ago, & used Superior/Slate sounds on that...I completely replaced all the drums on that except for the oh's...The band just didn't have the gear they needed (mics/pre's), so I threw the idea at them, & it turned out alright...I used Toontrack's Drumtracker, which does the wav/mp3 > midi thing & is discontinued now...

The drums (kick, snare, toms) are pretty easy the majority of the time, for me, the hard thing is getting the hi-hats to sound right...

Thanks again dude...:)
 
Miner,

This might interest you
https://youtu.be/0f7vBuzGI3A
I found the earlier videos in this series handy but a lot of the shit in this video is way beyond me. I still found some good tips in it though. You'll understand everything he's going on about.
 
Thanks for the link Jdude, I always try to watch videos like this because I might learn something different/new to try...

If you're still using Reaper, I'd recommend a couple little scripts that you can assign to toolbar buttons that let you select different patterns, & randomize the velocity...It sounds complicated, but once you try it, these scripts work really good IMO...Makes things much easier, & much faster IMO...

Here are a couple little things I use for adjusting velocities for my drums. These kinda get 'em in the ballpark, but you might wanna adjust/edit some hits here/there...


You'll need to make a toolbar in the midi editor for each one , & you can name 'em whatever you like on the toolbar...

MIDI Note Selector

Randomize Velocities with GUI

1) download the scripts above (you can choose the folder, you just need to make sure Reaper knows where they are)
2) open the Action list

This is how to add a script into the "Action list" (and how to make a MIDI toolbar button):
toolbar%20button.gif




Here's what they look like when in use (the toolbars are hi-lighted in red here):



These 2 scripts are really handy, for example a drummer might hit the 1st & 3rd snare hits a little harder, these scripts allow you to select the 1st/3rd hits, so you can adjust their velocity, without having to go through selecting each hit one by one, which is a great time-saver for me....

Just remember to make a time selection so the note selector "knows" what you want selected, & the scrollwheel changes the notes that are selected...

Hope this helps, if you're interested in this & have trouble getting it going, lemme know, I'll try to walk you through it...
 
Miner, you're like some weird Hillbilly genius! Gonna be busy as fuck over the next few days but I'm definitely gonna try this one. I'm only using EZ Drummer not Superior Drummer, mind.
 
He really is. I've been using Reaper for over 10 years and have no idea what the fuck he's talking about.

I know - when he was talking me through using EZ Drummer and sorting out some samples I have this huge email chain where he's explaining the whole thing to me.
 
Weird hillbilly genius...I might put that on my avatar...:laughings:

Wow guys, thanks for the confidence boost, but really, I've just learned a bunch of shit that helps me to do things faster/easier...Reaper is the perfect daw for me because it's so easy to custom-ize to the individual user...

I do admit I went overboard/bat shit crazy on the drum programming, but I want my fake drums to sound as good as possible, so I dove into 'em headfirst & tried to learn as much as I could...Over the years I've just found a lot of things that helped me, so I'm just trying to pass what I've learned on to others...

I've also been at the drum programming thing for about 7-8 years now, so I've got quite a bit of experience with these things too, & I've learned what each one's strength/weakness' are...

The great thing about those 2 scripts are they work with any drum sampler/vsti, & for me, they make things much easier plus a hell of a lot faster, which for me, easier/faster is always good, as long as the end result is what I'm after...

There are a lot of little tricks you can use with these fake drums that IMHO really help to make 'em sound better...
 
So Jdude, did you get around to trying those little tricks out yet??? I'm pretty curious to know what you (or anyone else) think about 'em...
 
So Jdude, did you get around to trying those little tricks out yet??? I'm pretty curious to know what you (or anyone else) think about 'em...

No, I've been busy as fuck for all of the last week and over the last weekend. I will hopefully get chance to have a quick go with it either tonight or tomorrow on my lap-top. If that works then I might try stuff out on my main recording PC over the weekend... although I did manage a quick recording with my new Ukulele on Saturday afternoon.
 
Hope this helps, if you're interested in this & have trouble getting it going, lemme know, I'll try to walk you through it...
Miner, having a play with this and I'm pretty stumped pretty quickly. I think its partly paranoia about fucking up a programme that works fine as it is.
I opened up actions and went to add the MIDI note selector and it told me that I already had one and did I want to replace it. I thought cancel was the safer option here!
 
Miner, having a play with this and I'm pretty stumped pretty quickly. I think its partly paranoia about fucking up a programme that works fine as it is.
I opened up actions and went to add the MIDI note selector and it told me that I already had one and did I want to replace it. I thought cancel was the safer option here!

Lemme see if I can remember how to do this without opening Reaper...

Double click on a midi item to open the piano roll

Right-click where the toolbar is in the piano roll, & select "Customize Toolbar"

A pop-up window will appear with all your scripts, click "Add"

A pop-up window of your scripts will appear, highlight the one you want, then click "Select" (if you select one & it asks if you wanna replace it, select "Yes" it's no big deal dude)

At the bottom a new toolbar button should appear, make sure it's selected, & click the "Icon" button

Another pop up window will appear, & select "Double width text button" (makes the button bigger so the name you give it can be longer), then name your button


Remember when using these scripts to work in "parts" (verse, chorus, bridge, etc)...

Make a time selection of the verse, chorus, whatever you're working on, or the scripts will select/change all the midi notes that are in the whole song...

This is how I use 'em, I'll work on one part until I get all the midi randomized, then move on to the next part...

I had trouble getting them to work at first, but once I "got it", it's really pretty simple...Lemme know if this helps...


And if all this just confuses you even more here is the post I made with the pics describing how to get 'em going...
 
Lemme see if I can remember how to do this without opening Reaper...

Double click on a midi item to open the piano roll

Right-click where the toolbar is in the piano roll, & select "Customize Toolbar"

A pop-up window will appear with all your scripts, click "Add"

A pop-up window of your scripts will appear, highlight the one you want, then click "Select" (if you select one & it asks if you wanna replace it, select "Yes" it's no big deal dude)

At the bottom a new toolbar button should appear, make sure it's selected, & click the "Icon" button

Another pop up window will appear, & select "Double width text button" (makes the button bigger so the name you give it can be longer), then name your button


Remember when using these scripts to work in "parts" (verse, chorus, bridge, etc)...

Make a time selection of the verse, chorus, whatever you're working on, or the scripts will select/change all the midi notes that are in the whole song...

This is how I use 'em, I'll work on one part until I get all the midi randomized, then move on to the next part...

I had trouble getting them to work at first, but once I "got it", it's really pretty simple...Lemme know if this helps...


And if all this just confuses you even more here is the post I made with the pics describing how to get 'em going...
Cheers, I'll take a look at this tomorrow. I've just started working on a blues project which is really out of character for me and this technique could be really useful.
 
For what it's worth, I did a trial run of EZ Drummer and did like it, however, the $150.00 price tag was a bit too much not to mention the additional $30.00 a pop for the add in packs. So, I was cruising around YouTube and found a FREE Plug-In called MTPower Drum Kit. Let me tell you, I have no need to spend the $150.00 bucks for EZDrummer. It would be nice, but unless you are really intense about your songs, I don't think you're going to mind, especially at that price, (FREE). I also find it has more samples out of the box.

Cons - You can't adjust each instrument like you can with EZ drummer and you are limited to 8 channels out in the mixer in MTPower Drummer. I get around this by sending all crash cymbals out to one channel and all HiHat out to one channel. It has made a huge difference in my songs and does sound natural.

Just my 2 cents. Thought anyone looking for drums would like to check it out.
 
Thought anyone looking for drums would like to check it out.

Watching the video on the site, I do like that their fills section is a separate tab within each groove. Def makes it easier to find what you're looking for. Perhaps ToonTrack will adopt this in the future. I don't like having to sort through 50 fills within a tempo trying to find one that matches my groove closely enough, so I end up picking something close and writing the rest of the fill myself.
 
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